From MAILER-DAEMON Sat May 6 03:40:23 2000 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 03:40:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Mail System Internal Data Subject: DON'T DELETE THIS MESSAGE -- FOLDER INTERNAL DATA X-IMAP: 0954643101 0000000118 Status: RO This text is part of the internal format of your mail folder, and is not a real message. It is created automatically by the mail system software. If deleted, important folder data will be lost, and it will be re-created with the data reset to initial values. From fang@xys.org Fri Mar 31 18:32:36 2000 -0800 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail7.listbot.com ([204.71.191.5]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA08294 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:32:35 -0600 Received: (qmail 775 invoked by uid 108); 1 Apr 2000 02:31:22 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 16212 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2000 02:30:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 1 Apr 2000 02:30:55 -0000 Received: from p2 by mail.qdcatv.com.cn with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Sat, 01 Apr 2000 10:21:34 +0800 Message-ID: <008901bf9b7e$42a11220$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <0FSB002WSAS6NS@email.cta.cq.cn> Subject: Re: Re: Re: [xys_friends] forward for a friend Date: Sat, 1 Apr 2000 10:01:54 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 1 - http://www.xys.org > - http://www.xys.org > > >最近几个月一直在玩一个叫“三角洲力量”（Delta Force）的游戏， > > DELTA FORCE我第二代都打了个遍，而且每种武器都试了一遍。最好用 > 的武器是自动步枪，最好玩的是狙击步枪，最刺激的是机枪，但机枪 > 因为没有瞄准器，不大容易过关。打DELTA FORCE需要点谋略的。 螳螂可以玩起来二代，看来机器配置可不低啊。二代的大狙击没有一代 那么厉害，一代是挨着便死，碰着就亡，二代通常要打好几枪，这对于 狙击手太危险了，不好玩。 机枪也是可以瞄准的，你可以用火箭筒的瞄准镜或用激光测距器。 三角洲单机打没什么意思，得连线打，最佳是8-10个人一起打。单机打 任务的时候，可以选多人游戏，建个主机，选合作过关模式。这时，你 被打死之后，就会立刻复活了。：） > VR现在算得上是传统游戏了，前不久还看到有几个同事还把它翻了出 > 来打着玩。 能被人翻出来重新玩的游戏就能称得上是好游戏了。VR战士是世嘉的打 斗游戏，后来给移植到了PC上。世嘉做这个游戏的时候，派出不少人到 各个门派去考察各派真实的武术招式到底是什么样，可谓是费尽了心思。 所以VR战士给别的打斗游戏不太一样，没有那些夸张的气动波之类的玩 意，但一招一式都透着韵味，每个人招式的特点都很鲜明。像舜帝的醉 拳，就是以柔克刚，四两拨千斤。现在在世嘉机器的VR战士出了第三代， 招式更多，画面更漂亮，老舜帝还带上了顶瓜皮小帽。哎，为什么在老 外眼里，总喜欢给中国人带上顶难看的瓜皮帽？ --一叶 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Fri Mar 31 19:58:16 2000 -0800 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA08596 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 21:58:16 -0600 Received: (qmail 256 invoked by uid 108); 1 Apr 2000 03:56:57 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 9747 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2000 03:59:33 -0000 Received: from f99.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.99) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 1 Apr 2000 03:59:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 97861 invoked by uid 0); 1 Apr 2000 03:55:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20000401035513.97860.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 202.105.42.4 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 19:55:12 PST X-Originating-IP: [202.105.42.4] From: "minghy minghy" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 配音 Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 11:55:12 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 2 - http://www.xys.org >From: "Ding Ye" >Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >Subject: Re: Re: [xys_friends] forward for a friend >Date: Sat, 1 Apr 2000 00:41:29 +0800 > > - http://www.xys.org > >另外，这两天在看中央8的《大明宫词》，看介绍讲的是武则天和太平公 >主的事。不知道这里有没有人也在看。总的感觉，很华丽，无论从服装、 >色彩、布景到对白。特别是对白，是话剧般的，很独特。以前看历史剧， >导演总是追求符合历史，连对白都是半文半白的，像是看历史书，导演 >的个性反倒看不出来。这部剧采用了话剧的语言，确实与众不同，与话 >剧相比，华丽的布景和服装，加上镜头的运用，更能出效果。我觉得采 >用这种话剧语言，可能还有个好处就是很容易翻译，并且翻译之后也不 >会怎么跑味，往海外卖的时候容易走红。现在演太平公主的是个年轻的 >小演员，小太平公主那种应有的任性纯洁的味道基本演出来了。成年太 >平好象是陈红，目前还没露面，真担心这部戏让她给糟蹋了，她的演技 >可是不怎么敢恭维的。看地出，这部剧中演绎人物的视角大多是从现代 >人的角度去演绎的，像今天晚上的一集中，就用了很多的笔墨去描写李 >弘和他同性恋爱人之间的爱情。这种古为今用的做法，想必评论家们会 >评头论足的。我觉得没什么不好，又没人把这当成记录片，现代人看历 >史人物，总是要带着自己的观念去看，导演爱怎么演绎都好。 > >--一叶 这部戏中央台老早就在宣扬了，导演李少红，加上主演周迅、陈红（一个 是陈凯歌的妻子，一个是陈推荐的红人结果被媒体宣扬了一番）和赵文暄 都是明星。我是觉得服装华美，国内拍历史剧往往是不怕下本钱的。难怪 我老妈总纳闷那些服装拍完了以后怎么个处置。 就是一叶说的这种话剧体，是国内电影电视我最受不了的一点。我认为 这是这部剧最致命的一点，你演的再好一配音就假了。可能有些人对配音 不是特别敏感，我是不行的，他一张嘴就能听出来，一听出来就受不了。 泥 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 1 13:21:51 2000 -0800 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA10946 for ; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 15:21:50 -0600 Received: (qmail 26447 invoked by uid 108); 1 Apr 2000 21:20:31 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 11324 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2000 21:18:50 -0000 Received: from f04s07.cac.psu.edu (HELO f04n07.cac.psu.edu) (128.118.141.35) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 1 Apr 2000 21:18:50 -0000 Received: from zzw01.cac.psu.edu (zzw01.aers.psu.edu [146.186.114.24]) by f04n07.cac.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA177784 for ; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 16:18:47 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000331161401.00807ae0@email.psu.edu> X-Sender: yxz11@email.psu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 16:14:01 -0500 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: Yu Zhang Subject: Re: Re: Re: [xys_friends] forward for a friend In-Reply-To: <0FSB002WSAS6NS@email.cta.cq.cn> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id PAA10946 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3 - http://www.xys.org At 08:46 AM 04/02/1999 +0800, you wrote: >>>我的专业级水平是144秒。：）我们单位的最高记录是120秒左右 >> >>螳螂可真是个高手啊。扫雷我很久没玩，所以才说错了。我打游戏喜 >>动不喜静，喜欢飞行模拟啦，FIFA啦之类的游戏。以前在宿舍的时候， >>看到同学排雷能排一下午，实在是替他们觉得憋闷。他们的水平挺高， >>也是差不多100多秒的水平。 > >呵呵，咱们这儿可以排个座次了。现在随波是冠军，142秒。老 >万兄和我并列亚军，144秒。 > >我知道的最高记录是80多秒，据说那个人在创记录前要洗手和 >冥想的。 My record is 131 seconds. At that time, I had nothing else to do and played it day and night for about two months. However, someone told me that he could finish it in about 70+ seconds and showed me the record. I know he was lying since he know less tricks then me and I don't think he can beat me for 50+ seconds by merely "thinking" without intuition. The record can easily be modified. At that time, he played far slower than me and his excuse is he hadn't played it for a long time. Later on, I heard people saying that someone they know can finished it in less than 100 seconds but they never actually saw them finished in such a short time. I really want to know if anyone actually finished it or saw others finished it in less than 100 seconds. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 3 00:08:40 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA17158 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 02:08:39 -0500 Received: (qmail 28394 invoked by uid 108); 3 Apr 2000 07:07:01 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4530 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2000 07:08:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 3 Apr 2000 07:08:57 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.146.217]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSF0096AI7X8B@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 15:02:55 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:08:18 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: [xys_friends] Fw for xiaomao To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSF0096BI7Y8B@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_5FYpNcBh1qgq4WScnt8iLw)" Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 4 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_5FYpNcBh1qgq4WScnt8iLw) Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable - http://www.xys.org =D0=A4=C3=AB=B5=C4=BB=FA=C6=F7=B4=F3=B8=C5=B3=F6=C1=CB=C3=AB=B2=A1=A3=AC=D3=D6=B7=A2=B2=BB=B3=C9=D0=C5=C1=CB=A1=A3=CE=D2=B4=FA=D7=AA=D2=BB=CF=C2=A1=A3 ------------------------------------------------------------ =A1=B6=C0=CA=B6=C1=D5=DF=A1=B7=CF=EB=D2=AA=B8=E6=CB=DF=CE=D2=C3=C7=CA=B2=C3=B4 =A1=AA=A1=AA=B2=B5=A1=B6=C7=E9=D3=DA=CB=B9=A3=AC=B1=AF=D3=DA=CB=B9=A1=B7=D2=BB=CE=C4=D6=D0=B5=C4=C4=B3=D0=A9=B9=DB=B5=E3 =A3=A8=D7=A2=A3=BA=A1=B6=C0=CA=B6=C1=D5=DF=A1=B7=A3=AC=B5=C2=B9=FA =B1=BE=B9=FE=B5=C2=A1=A4=CA=A9=C1=D6=BF=CB=D6=F8=A3=AC=D2=A6=D6=D9=D5=E4=D2=EB=A3=AC=D2=EB=CE=C4=BF=AF=D4=D8=D3=DA 2000=C4=EA=B5=DA=B6=FE=C6=DA=A1=B6=D2=EB=C1=D6=A1=B7=D4=D3=D6=BE=A1=A3=D0=A1=CB=B5=C7=E9=BD=DA=B4=F3=B8=C5=C8=E7=CF=C2=A3=BA15=CB=EA=B5=C4=C9=D9=C4=EA=C3=D7=CF=C4=B6=FB =C5=BC=D3=F636=CB=EA=B5=C4=CA=DB=C6=B1=D4=B1=BA=BA=C4=C8=A3=AC=BA=F3=C1=BD=C8=CB=B7=A2=C9=FA=C1=CB=D0=D4=B9=D8=CF=B5=A1=A3=BA=BA=C4=C8=CF=B2=BB=B6=C3=D7=CF=C4=B6=FB=B8=F8=CB=FD =D4=C4=B6=C1=CE=C4=D1=A7=C3=FB=D6=F8=A3=AC=B5=AB=BA=F3=C0=B4=D3=D6=C9=F1=C3=D8=B5=C4=CA=A7=D7=D9=A1=A3=C3=D7=CF=C4=B6=FB=C9=CF=B4=F3=D1=A7=BA=F3=A3=AC=B6=FE=D5=BD=D2=D1=BE=AD=BD=E1 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FAA18063 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 05:59:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 14884 invoked by uid 108); 3 Apr 2000 10:58:02 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 19856 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2000 10:56:18 -0000 Received: from imfep02.kcom.ne.jp (210.174.120.146) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 3 Apr 2000 10:56:18 -0000 Received: from myhost ([210.230.105.77]) by imfep02.kcom.ne.jp (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000403105613.JXWM981.imfep02.kcom.ne.jp@myhost> for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 19:56:13 +0900 Message-ID: <002201bf9d5b$317e0370$4d69e6d2@myhost> From: "zhouping" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: RE: [xys_friends] Fw for xiaomao Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 19:55:53 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3612.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 5 - http://www.xys.org >这部小说的译文非常上乘，是近年少见的好译文。让我在这里以读者 >的身份对译者表示感谢和敬意！可惜，译文里有两处值得商榷的地方。 >一是这句：“空气回荡，街道热得闪闪发光”。我觉得，“热”的结 晴朗炎热的夏天, 顶着烈日走在一段直路上时，可以看到一种“奇特” 的现象。眺望远处，路面上就好象镶着一面镜子。镜子上映照着远方的 景色，是一片梦幻般的倒影。小时候在湖南乡村的岁月里，常常躲在树 阴下盯着那倒影出神半天，忘了还要去砍柴。如果是一片坡路，当人朝 坡上走时，看到坡顶的这面镜子，往往闪闪发光。 不管是土路还是柏油路、水泥路，都可以看到这种现象。不知道原著者 是不是说的这码事。 乐平 2000.04.03 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 3 20:11:31 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA21866 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 22:11:31 -0500 Received: (qmail 21952 invoked by uid 108); 4 Apr 2000 03:28:33 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 10427 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 03:08:39 -0000 Received: from law-f157.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.220) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 03:08:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 58847 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 03:08:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20000404030802.58846.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 132.236.102.192 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 20:08:01 PDT X-Originating-IP: [132.236.102.192] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 半月谈 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 03:08:01 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 6 - http://www.xys.org 　　　　　　　　　半　月　谈 　　　　　　　　　　　应　帆 　　好象是有这么一个谜题的：谜面是“说胖”，打一杂志名，卷帘格。谜底是 “半月谈”──半月者，胖也；说者，谈也。本篇名叫“半月谈”，却跟政治毫 无关系；用的乃是这谜题的反面：半月谈者，说胖也。说到这里，又想起这“胖” 字的构成：一边是月，一边是半，一月过半，正是三五之夕，月亮胖起来的日子。 老祖宗端的是聪明，一个汉字里包含多少玄机和诗意。 　　我自诩也是喜欢观察的人，然而对人变胖或是变瘦却眼拙得很，若非明显的 横里发展或者肚子腆起，我很少能说出人是丰满还是苗条了。然而周围却也总有 这样的人，一两个月不见，就能说出你的胖瘦，甚至推断出你生活滋润与否来。 象咱外婆，以往每次回去，总是说“瘦了瘦了，学习苦，吃不饱”，我怎么跟她 说我在学校的伙食比她的有油水养人，都不能让心疼外孙的老太太改变成见。听 我说要减肥，外婆加上父母全部叫起来：胖些好！ 　　长辈的“闻胖而喜，闻瘦则忧”，大约跟他们曾经的苦穷日子有关系，就连 我这样的七十年代生的人，对童年时期农村的困苦生活还是很有一些记忆的。虽 然已经不晓得自己小时候的样子，然而说是面黄肌瘦大概总是不离其宗。曾经有 人问妈妈，说“你家不给儿子吃饭嘛？”妈妈当然就红脸，接着否定。我想我现 在是可以找出当时的原因的：虽然能吃饱，但是肚子里蛔虫不少，尽给它们当枪 手了；而且我那时候见到白菜犹如见到毒药，又没有水果吃，到最后“面黄肌瘦 ”也就顺理成章了。可怜这种面黄肌瘦还是我顶漂亮的时候：上高二那年，爸妈 无意中说到：这孩子越长越丑了。我虽不是个要“为悦己者容”的女孩子，然听 到自己父母的评价，仍是闷闷不乐了许久。 上高中时，吃了三年的包伙，食谱上是每周一到二顿大菜。所谓大菜，不过 是雪里蕻烧肉之类。可惜肉少菜多，而且又多是我不吃的肥肉，同桌的七个人， 有三四个更是如狼似虎的莽少年，往往小测验时候不顾题没做全就交卷去食堂抢 食大菜的。如此这般，搞得我那时吃着“比家里好”的饭菜，反而更不如在家中 “肥”了。记得有一年暑假没补课，自己在家里扎扎实实呆了近五十天，回校的 时候，就有人惊讶地叫出来“哎呀，我都认不出你来了！” 那位同学显然是夸张了。但一年后，当我走进大学宿舍，站在三个身高不下 １７０厘米体重不上１００斤的舍友面前，我深深感到自己原来已经进化为一个 胖子了。但是舍友们却很友好，说“到科大来的都是瘦子”，把我拉进了同一战 线。 　　我们在同一战线奋斗了四年，这期间四人的身高虽然原地踏足踏，体重却都 勉强过了１０５的界线，象我已经达到１１０之上了，颇有些“先胖起来”的豪 情，并积极推荐自己的致“胖”技术：早晚只吃稀饭馒头啦，中午六毛钱的菜已 经不错了，千万别吃零嘴，晚上饿就饿些，还买方便面干啥呀……舍友很不忿： 第一，你那胖不算胖；第二，我们这瘦真叫瘦；第三，有人基础好，喝凉水也长 肉；咱们底子薄，喝凉水只可能塞牙，不开开小灶吃吃大肉，更没希望长胖了。 　　大家发现我真地“胖”了起来在大四的夏天：那天和辉在路上碰到我一个广 义的女老乡，她突然以女孩特有的神秘表情说道：“你现在是不是日子过得很滋 润？”我当时一没得恋二没失恋（据说这两样东西都是既可以叫人瘦也可以叫人 胖的），只好一如往昔地邻家大男孩般红着脸问她“为什么这么说？”“因为你 发福了啊！”我还来不及生发出感觉，只是不断否认辉说的老乡对我有意的玩笑， 就又碰上辉的师姐，她定定地望了我半天，又以女性的夸张说道：“你就是某某 某吗？”辉说怎么了，师姐说：“他胖得我都快认不出来了！”我们共同地惊讶， 然后自己不知该是欢喜还是悲伤。中午上床午觉时，后上床的辉看我两眼，不怀 好意地笑道：“我发现你确实胖了；胸大肌好象有二三两重了嘛！” 　　仔细看看，大四的我确实已经本着“一部分人先胖起来”的原则，成了我们 宿舍率先“脱瘦致胖”的好青年：当时干着一份有点亲戚关系的家教，工资很低， 每月只有六百大毛，然而诱人的是那每周两次的家庭小宴，每每让我腆肚打嗝地 骑车回校后百事无心，又没了让人害怕的一百米非要十几秒跑完之类的体育达标 的压力：有更好的填充，没有更多的释放，稍微胖胖大约也是应该的。我的同学 刘进就说“老应这个胖啊，胖得恰到好处，既不……也不……不是……而是……” 我跟《围城》里范小姐一样，明知道他说假话，还是笑得满面开花。 　　等到读研究生，有了一点自己的工资，几个好朋友更是有来由没来由地时不 时出去凤爪猪蹄地吃一顿。第二个寒假后回校，曾经被我笑的大胖子刘禾已经笑 我是“五十步笑一百步”了。自己也厚着脸皮幽默道：教授教授，越教越瘦；硕 士硕士，不硕怎士？心安理得地又“硕”到了夏天。 　　且说夏天一到，脱了衣裳，坐在床边，低头一看，自己的肚子上居然层峦叠 嶂了，那白色的物事却有让我两眼一黑晕倒在床的本事……从此再不敢看自己的 肚子，更不敢随便坐下来了。我的同学们更喜欢开我的玩笑了：某些人就是太过 份了，不仅每天诗啊小说啊的精神小资，如今肉体也开始小资起来了…… 　　于是开始象人戒烟一般，时不时地就要实行减肥计划了。每每睡觉前心血来 潮，一通仰卧起坐，搞得床动铺摇，下铺的就叫苦连天。只是这样的减肥跟别人 的戒烟一样，不过是西西里斯推石头，上去再下来而已，甚而至于有些围城的感 觉──胖的时候想瘦，忽然瘦下来，又要怀念胖的日子了。那年在大庆出长差， 某日在自由市场花五角钱称了一下体重，忽然比平常轻了十来斤，先是一喜，接 着吃惊，后来却越想越怕：最近没有减肥运动啊，东北大菜吃得也对胃口……看 无聊的报纸杂志，就有健康顾问提醒道：体重突然减轻的原因之一可能是得了癌 症……只吓得我惶惶不可终日，等到回了学校，忙着又去称了一回体重，却又回 到原来的“肥胖”水准了，骂了几声那不知准也不准的东北称才算安心。 　　到了美国，自己做菜了，只晓得“油多不坏菜”，又听说鸡肉便宜，不免多 油多肉地过起日子来。一年下来，又添了十磅的样子。每回给家里电话，父母还 犹自关心道：瘦了没有啊？在美国吃不吃得惯吃不吃得饱？真叫我哭笑不得。 　　二十五岁生日过了两三春，也可以不时来句“人到中年”的调侃了，对自己 中等偏胖的体重忽然也很心安理得起来，不仅时时有“小时候胖不算胖”的感慨， 更隐隐觉得：如今这副体重才是一个男人的样子，不必干瘦得给人以奸诈之感。 （侵引用科大网友老俗的说法：我认识的苗条男士和读到此处的苗条男性读者 之合集，不属于此干瘦奸诈相交的男性合集。:)） 　　前阵子一个广义的女朋友要给我介绍狭义的女朋友，欣然应允。如今网络时 代，忙着在网上互传了照片。人家看了我五年前和现在的两张照片，不免有些疑 心地问我现在胖了多少，这一问吓得我忙着跟广义的女朋友说：我现在的身材嘛， 虽不是“增一分则胖，减一分则瘦”，却也是“增十斤才肥，减廿磅则瘦”的好 胚子！话虽这么说，到底心里害怕，那减肥的计划就又捡起来了：多吃素，少吃 肉，每天二十俯卧撑，三十个仰卧起坐……就是不晓得会是月减月瘦呢，还是要 越减越肥了！ 　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　2000.3.17 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 3 21:26:01 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA22265 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:26:01 -0500 Received: (qmail 5358 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 04:31:40 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 20684 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 04:22:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 04:22:55 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id MAA01653 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 12:22:09 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 6 Apr 1999 04:46:21 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA4949 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 12:19:11 +0800 From: "jccb4" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 12:19:11 +0800 Message-ID: <20000404041910.AAA4949@jccb4> Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 7 - http://www.xys.org > > > > > > > >>古琴有点作做，于是琵琶就显得雅了。但是也得看是 > > > > ：我觉得琵琶曲听多了，有些累。我宁愿听些古筝，二胡，箫，埙 > > > > 等乐器演奏的曲子。香港雨果公司出了不少这些民乐的发烧碟，如 > > > > 《天幻箫音》等，我是见一张就买一张。当然，都是盗版的。 > > > > > > > > 肖毛 > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 02:20:40 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA23158 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 04:20:40 -0500 Received: (qmail 2704 invoked by uid 108); 4 Apr 2000 09:19:14 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26790 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 09:18:54 -0000 Received: from f328.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.240.203) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 09:18:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 100 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 09:17:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20000404091729.99998.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 202.104.86.90 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 02:17:29 PDT X-Originating-IP: [202.104.86.90] From: "minghy minghy" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 电影&小说 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 17:17:29 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 8 - http://www.xys.org 小说与电影 去年获oscar多项提名的《伊丽莎白》不愧为近年难得的历史片佳作，扮演者看起来都是有戏剧表演功底的演员，总的来说，有一点舞台演出的味道。其中最出色的是来自澳大利亚的女主演凯.布兰奇和扮演警务大臣沃西厄姆的演员（好象也是前两年获奖影片钢琴师的主演）。 其实，我对《伊丽莎白》的兴趣，很大程度上是在电影之外。我更渴望看到一部讲述女王一生的全传记电影。如果以历史的角度去看待这部电影多少会有些不满，但对这段历史一无所知的人也许又会觉得隔膜。 首先，它似乎篡改了历史，苏格兰女王在茨威格的传记中是在晚年被伊送上断头台而非伊丽莎白忠心耿耿的沃西厄姆的暗杀（我看了两遍才确定气质爽辣的芬妮.阿尔当扮演的的确是苏女王）；另外一点，是影片交代的是伊丽莎白从公主成为童贞女王（VIRGIRN QUEEN）的成长历程，但不知是由于译制导演的歪曲还是剧情本身使然，这个心路历程交代仍稍嫌单薄。 这也许是因为罗伯特的关系。伊丽莎白的爱人罗伯特似乎确有其人。不过我个人并不喜欢罗伯特在其中占太大分量，总觉得这个角色太没有说服力，该演员也比他哥哥拉尔夫.费恩斯差太远了。 随着玛丽女王的驾崩，新教与天主教的矛盾一触即发，伊丽莎白被不自觉地推上了历史舞台，她的经历（母亲被父王处决，自己的命运也往往是悬而未觉）使她有理由对她的处境谨小慎微、战战兢兢。但电影中最精彩的一段乃是新女王摄政后第一次正式与众大臣对簿朝廷，就宗教问题展开辩论与投票选举。伊丽莎白在滔滔雄辩中首次展示了她的果敢、从容和君临天下的气派---这也是一次演技的试炼石，凯特.布兰奇表现近乎完美。举个反例，最近重拍的《埃及女王》选了个大概是亚非血统的年轻女演员扮演克利奥佩特拉，形象健美而表演极之夸张，给人印象是徒有其表。倒是扮演恺撒的007老演员（名字记不得了）有非同一般的魅力（再一次证明了姜还是老的辣）。 重拍片有着一般大片的煽情和通俗性，倒也不认为它比当年伊丽莎白.泰勒那部耗资巨大的《埃及艳后》更烂。要不怎么说，金钱不是万能的：）。至少我更有耐心把新版本看完。这也是个好处，对电影有了兴致，转而也就会对那段历史发生兴趣。 我有一个很无知的疑问：多年来人们为什么对《克利奥佩特拉女王》念念不忘？出名的究竟是女王本人还是莎士比亚笔下的埃及艳后？在这部电影里，不论新老版本我都没有看出她有任何超出一般女人的伟大之处。电影的注脚似乎是：一位有野心的美貌女王，但是最后爱情战胜了一切。但这两次失败的表演（我从来没喜欢过泰勒）令我对于这个人物一些兴趣都无。 由《伊丽莎白》还想到一个老问题：看过它你才会发现美国人到底有多没文化（不是没有演技）。你看过好莱坞翻拍成功过什么经典名著没有？自然，各国的经典最好还是由本国去拍，但大卫.里恩拍《日瓦戈医生》虽然不那么俄国味儿也颇令人感动，至少主人公的塑造上他是比较成功的。还是那句话：我也是由了这部影片而产生对于小说本身的兴趣。当然也有例外，比如说《简爱》，凭良心说那部小说我始终没能耐着性子读完。 也有名声很响而让人大失所望的，斗胆提一出：《乱世佳人》。也许是在中学时期对于小说曾经爱不释手的缘故，最大的愿望就是能看到这部电影。然而事与愿违往往与它失之交臂---直到大学后半段，有一次和室友一块跑去看录象--那种失望的心情，到现在还记得很清楚。 不过如此！ 当然不是费雯丽没有表演天分，她是那种非常有个性、气质特别的明星演员。也不是号称影帝的克拉克盖博对不起观众。更何况这又是以南北战争为背景的本土电影。我似乎找不到任何足以批判它的理由。只能人云亦云地说：电影怎么可以和引起无边遐想的精妙文字相提并论呢？ 我看过的比较象样的改编是《战争与和平》---列位看官，千万不要以为我指的是好莱坞的版本，固然赫本版娜塔莎的苗条倩影与小鹿般清纯的大眼睛都让人念念不忘，但这也不能掩盖美国人拍经典片的那个令人难以容忍的粗糙劲儿。除了赫本，这部戏只带来你没有穷尽的懊恼。我指的是苏联邦达尔丘克自导自演（扮彼埃尔，他妻子在影片中也扮演了他的前妻）的那个版本（一共有四集），应该说较为忠于原著。俄罗斯人的朴素、伟大的灵魂，也只有俄罗斯人自己才能表现的淋漓尽致。正是那些原著中的华彩片段在电视上（我看的是电视）引起了我的注意，那些令人难以忘怀的，树叶闪闪发亮的夜晚，少女娜塔莎激动地想要飞起来，飞向那无以名状的永恒，她的热烈与纯真燃烧了安德来公爵的心，当他再一次经过森林里的老橡树，惊喜地发现它重又活过来了---安德来从这少女、从这橡树身上获得了重生。 BBC拍了不少本土的名著，我年少的时候看过《老古玩店》、《双城记》，后来则依次看了一些：《简爱》（也是那个007，不过在这部电影中他表现不妙，他太漂亮并且恐怕不适合演绎文学电影）、《名利场》、《妻子与女儿》（这是哪一部？）、《远离尘嚣》。好坏且不论，那循规蹈矩、含蓄低调的英国味儿还是很正宗的。而文学电影的经典莫过于E.M.福斯特的诸本小说改编之作。其实福斯特的主题往往是在挑战传统，怎想到现在变成了英国人的怀旧良药？电影与小说不同的是小说是由文字造成的冲击和无穷的想象，而电影一定要形成一种视觉上的冲击。这一点，福斯特小说的电影版做的非常成功！也许是个人偏好的原因，最失败的依我看还是对奥斯汀作品的改编，两个版本的《傲慢与偏见》、《理智与情感》、《Emma》通通不合我意。象《霍华德庄园》那样成功的改编电影大概是可遇而不可求的。 失败的例子实在是数之不胜。新版的《悲惨世界》根本不是那么回事（谁叫它是好莱坞版本，法国人的旧版本比较经典），老实说，能够老老实实地“忠于原著”也并不是一件太容易的事。事实和想象永远是有出入，金庸的小说翻拍来去几十年了，不是完全没有好作品，但想展示全貌的电视剧绝对失之拖沓，往往还形神兼失。陈小春的韦小宝夸张做作，吴倩莲在《神雕侠侣》中被人讥为非洲小龙女。倒是仅仅抓住其中一两条线索的徐克版《笑傲江湖》1、2集叫人惊鸿一瞥，分别以气势和人物取胜。近期央视版的《笑傲》据说启用一脸苦相的邵兵和许晴晴作为男女主演，前一阵子更有传闻说濮淳昕扮田伯光哈哈妙极。我等拭目以待任何活宝版本的金庸电视。 小说和电影电视的关系是千丝万缕，国内最具侵犯性的导演大概还是张艺谋，我总觉得他和小说、演员之间是强者与弱者的游戏，到最后必然都是沾染上强烈的张式特征。公平的说，我们不应把电影和小说混为一谈，不忠于原著就杀无赦。哈代的《苔丝》我始终没有看过原文，但我被罗曼.波兰斯基的同名电影深深触动，也许这是波兰斯基的苔丝，这不打紧。之后又看过他的《苦月亮》，他镜筒下的女性不自觉的生动肉感，特别是苔丝凭着几乎是动物性的本能顽强的生存下去直到毁灭，还有弥漫在其中的那种宿命的意味。不得不说成功的电影都带上了导演浓浓的个人色彩。 电影是一次再创作，成功与否不易评说，但是根据名著而改编的电影，往往不容易讨好观众。这也是没有办法的了。 泥 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 03:00:18 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA23243 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 05:00:18 -0500 Received: (qmail 20622 invoked by uid 7797); 4 Apr 2000 10:04:06 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 8325 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 09:56:37 -0000 Received: from smtp.screaming.net (212.49.224.20) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 09:56:37 -0000 Received: from default ([212.188.133.237]) by smtp.screaming.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA05052 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 09:57:27 GMT Message-Id: <200004040957.JAA05052@smtp.screaming.net> Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:50:34 +0000 From: To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 X-mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [cn] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 9 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 应帆是个女的,可这篇文章中怎么让人 男女不分啊. 弄到最后居然要找狭义 的女朋友了,让人狐疑 At 04/04/00 03:08:00, you wrote: > - http://www.xys.org > > > >　　　　　　　　　半　月　谈 > >　　　　　　　　　　　应　帆 > > >　　好象是有这么一个谜题的：谜面是“说胖”，打一杂志名，卷帘格。谜底是 >“半月谈”──半月者，胖也；说者，谈也。本篇名叫“半月谈”，却跟政治毫 >无关系；用的乃是这谜题的反面：半月谈者，说胖也。说到这里，又想起这“胖” >字的构成：一边是月，一边是半，一月过半，正是三五之夕，月亮胖起来的日子。 >老祖宗端的是聪明，一个汉字里包含多少玄机和诗意。 > >　　我自诩也是喜欢观察的人，然而对人变胖或是变瘦却眼拙得很，若非明显的 >横里发展或者肚子腆起，我很少能说出人是丰满还是苗条了。然而周围却也总有 >这样的人，一两个月不见，就能说出你的胖瘦，甚至推断出你生活滋润与否来。 >象咱外婆，以往每次回去，总是说“瘦了瘦了，学习苦，吃不饱”，我怎么跟她 >说我在学校的伙食比她的有油水养人，都不能让心疼外孙的老太太改变成见。听 >我说要减肥，外婆加上父母全部叫起来：胖些好！ > >　　长辈的“闻胖而喜，闻瘦则忧”，大约跟他们曾经的苦穷日子有关系，就连 >我这样的七十年代生的人，对童年时期农村的困苦生活还是很有一些记忆的。虽 >然已经不晓得自己小时候的样子，然而说是面黄肌瘦大概总是不离其宗。曾经有 >人问妈妈，说“你家不给儿子吃饭嘛？”妈妈当然就红脸，接着否定。我想我现 >在是可以找出当时的原因的：虽然能吃饱，但是肚子里蛔虫不少，尽给它们当枪 >手了；而且我那时候见到白菜犹如见到毒药，又没有水果吃，到最后“面黄肌瘦 >”也就顺理成章了。可怜这种面黄肌瘦还是我顶漂亮的时候：上高二那年，爸妈 >无意中说到：这孩子越长越丑了。我虽不是个要“为悦己者容”的女孩子，然听 >到自己父母的评价，仍是闷闷不乐了许久。 > > >上高中时，吃了三年的包伙，食谱上是每周一到二顿大菜。所谓大菜，不过 >是雪里蕻烧肉之类。可惜肉少菜多，而且又多是我不吃的肥肉，同桌的七个人， >有三四个更是如狼似虎的莽少年，往往小测验时候不顾题没做全就交卷去食堂抢 >食大菜的。如此这般，搞得我那时吃着“比家里好”的饭菜，反而更不如在家中 >“肥”了。记得有一年暑假没补课，自己在家里扎扎实实呆了近五十天，回校的 >时候，就有人惊讶地叫出来“哎呀，我都认不出你来了！” > > >那位同学显然是夸张了。但一年后，当我走进大学宿舍，站在三个身高不下 >１７０厘米体重不上１００斤的舍友面前，我深深感到自己原来已经进化为一个 >胖子了。但是舍友们却很友好，说“到科大来的都是瘦子”，把我拉进了同一战 >线。 > >　　我们在同一战线奋斗了四年，这期间四人的身高虽然原地踏足踏，体重却都 >勉强过了１０５的界线，象我已经达到１１０之上了，颇有些“先胖起来”的豪 >情，并积极推荐自己的致“胖”技术：早晚只吃稀饭馒头啦，中午六毛钱的菜已 >经不错了，千万别吃零嘴，晚上饿就饿些，还买方便面干啥呀……舍友很不忿： >第一，你那胖不算胖；第二，我们这瘦真叫瘦；第三，有人基础好，喝凉水也长 >肉；咱们底子薄，喝凉水只可能塞牙，不开开小灶吃吃大肉，更没希望长胖了。 > >　　大家发现我真地“胖”了起来在大四的夏天：那天和辉在路上碰到我一个广 >义的女老乡，她突然以女孩特有的神秘表情说道：“你现在是不是日子过得很滋 >润？”我当时一没得恋二没失恋（据说这两样东西都是既可以叫人瘦也可以叫人 >胖的），只好一如往昔地邻家大男孩般红着脸问她“为什么这么说？”“因为你 >发福了啊！”我还来不及生发出感觉，只是不断否认辉说的老乡对我有意的玩笑， >就又碰上辉的师姐，她定定地望了我半天，又以女性的夸张说道：“你就是某某 >某吗？”辉说怎么了，师姐说：“他胖得我都快认不出来了！”我们共同地惊讶， >然后自己不知该是欢喜还是悲伤。中午上床午觉时，后上床的辉看我两眼，不怀 >好意地笑道：“我发现你确实胖了；胸大肌好象有二三两重了嘛！” > >　　仔细看看，大四的我确实已经本着“一部分人先胖起来”的原则，成了我们 >宿舍率先“脱瘦致胖”的好青年：当时干着一份有点亲戚关系的家教，工资很低， >每月只有六百大毛，然而诱人的是那每周两次的家庭小宴，每每让我腆肚打嗝地 >骑车回校后百事无心，又没了让人害怕的一百米非要十几秒跑完之类的体育达标 >的压力：有更好的填充，没有更多的释放，稍微胖胖大约也是应该的。我的同学 >刘进就说“老应这个胖啊，胖得恰到好处，既不……也不……不是……而是……” >我跟《围城》里范小姐一样，明知道他说假话，还是笑得满面开花。 > >　　等到读研究生，有了一点自己的工资，几个好朋友更是有来由没来由地时不 >时出去凤爪猪蹄地吃一顿。第二个寒假后回校，曾经被我笑的大胖子刘禾已经笑 >我是“五十步笑一百步”了。自己也厚着脸皮幽默道：教授教授，越教越瘦；硕 >士硕士，不硕怎士？心安理得地又“硕”到了夏天。 > >　　且说夏天一到，脱了衣裳，坐在床边，低头一看，自己的肚子上居然层峦叠 >嶂了，那白色的物事却有让我两眼一黑晕倒在床的本事……从此再不敢看自己的 >肚子，更不敢随便坐下来了。我的同学们更喜欢开我的玩笑了：某些人就是太过 >份了，不仅每天诗啊小说啊的精神小资，如今肉体也开始小资起来了…… > >　　于是开始象人戒烟一般，时不时地就要实行减肥计划了。每每睡觉前心血来 >潮，一通仰卧起坐，搞得床动铺摇，下铺的就叫苦连天。只是这样的减肥跟别人 >的戒烟一样，不过是西西里斯推石头，上去再下来而已，甚而至于有些围城的感 >觉──胖的时候想瘦，忽然瘦下来，又要怀念胖的日子了。那年在大庆出长差， >某日在自由市场花五角钱称了一下体重，忽然比平常轻了十来斤，先是一喜，接 >着吃惊，后来却越想越怕：最近没有减肥运动啊，东北大菜吃得也对胃口……看 >无聊的报纸杂志，就有健康顾问提醒道：体重突然减轻的原因之一可能是得了癌 >症……只吓得我惶惶不可终日，等到回了学校，忙着又去称了一回体重，却又回 >到原来的“肥胖”水准了，骂了几声那不知准也不准的东北称才算安心。 > >　　到了美国，自己做菜了，只晓得“油多不坏菜”，又听说鸡肉便宜，不免多 >油多肉地过起日子来。一年下来，又添了十磅的样子。每回给家里电话，父母还 >犹自关心道：瘦了没有啊？在美国吃不吃得惯吃不吃得饱？真叫我哭笑不得。 > >　　二十五岁生日过了两三春，也可以不时来句“人到中年”的调侃了，对自己 >中等偏胖的体重忽然也很心安理得起来，不仅时时有“小时候胖不算胖”的感慨， >更隐隐觉得：如今这副体重才是一个男人的样子，不必干瘦得给人以奸诈之感。 >（侵引用科大网友老俗的说法：我认识的苗条男士和读到此处的苗条男性读者 >之合集，不属于此干瘦奸诈相交的男性合集。:)） > > >　　前阵子一个广义的女朋友要给我介绍狭义的女朋友，欣然应允。如今网络时 >代，忙着在网上互传了照片。人家看了我五年前和现在的两张照片，不免有些疑 >心地问我现在胖了多少，这一问吓得我忙着跟广义的女朋友说：我现在的身材嘛， >虽不是“增一分则胖，减一分则瘦”，却也是“增十斤才肥，减廿磅则瘦”的好 >胚子！话虽这么说，到底心里害怕，那减肥的计划就又捡起来了：多吃素，少吃 >肉，每天二十俯卧撑，三十个仰卧起坐……就是不晓得会是月减月瘦呢，还是要 >越减越肥了！ > > >　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　2000.3.17 > > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > >______________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com >______________________________________________________________________ >Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com > ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 05:47:21 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA23619 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 07:47:20 -0500 Received: (qmail 10689 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 12:53:05 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 14930 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 12:48:43 -0000 Received: from f186.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.186) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 12:48:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 9244 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 12:44:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20000404124409.9243.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 202.104.49.199 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 05:44:09 PDT X-Originating-IP: [202.104.49.199] From: "minghy minghy" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:44:09 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 10 - http://www.xys.org >From: >Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >To: Friends of Xin Yu Si >Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 >Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:50:34 +0000 > >Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org > >应帆是个女的,可这篇文章中怎么让人 >男女不分啊. 弄到最后居然要找狭义 >的女朋友了,让人狐疑 > 哈哈，看到一位同我一样“雌雄不辩”的，闹笑话的 原不止我啊。差点就要冲着应帆大姐前大姐后了。 应帆这篇文章是不是也为了验明正身而写：）？ 泥 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 09:06:08 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA24335 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 11:06:08 -0500 Received: (qmail 21473 invoked by uid 108); 4 Apr 2000 16:04:42 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 6075 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 16:04:17 -0000 Received: from law-f73.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.136) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 16:04:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 95094 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 16:02:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20000404160252.95093.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 18.251.1.122 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 09:02:51 PDT X-Originating-IP: [18.251.1.122] From: "Muzi Muzi" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 16:02:51 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 11 - http://www.xys.org >>应帆是个女的,可这篇文章中怎么让人 >>男女不分啊. 弄到最后居然要找狭义 >>的女朋友了,让人狐疑 >> >哈哈，看到一位同我一样“雌雄不辩”的，闹笑话的 >原不止我啊。差点就要冲着应帆大姐前大姐后了。 > >应帆这篇文章是不是也为了验明正身而写：）？ 我读这篇的反应是: 看到应帆的名字: 男 (BASED ON IMPRESSION FROM PAST ARTICLES) 读到中间: 应帆是女的?! 往下读: 男的? 折回去重读: 男 验明正身: 男 有XYS网上应帆的照片为证. :) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 18:38:45 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA26592 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:38:44 -0500 Received: (qmail 1996 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 01:55:58 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4884 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 01:35:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 01:35:43 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.159.48]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSI00LOFSBOYM@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:33:25 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 09:39:23 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B0=EB=D4=C2=CC=B8?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSI00LOHSBOYM@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id UAA26592 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 12 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-4 20:44:00 minghy minghy写道： >>Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org >> >>应帆是个女的,可这篇文章中怎么让人 >>男女不分啊. 弄到最后居然要找狭义 >>的女朋友了,让人狐疑 >> >哈哈，看到一位同我一样“雌雄不辩”的，闹笑话的 >原不止我啊。差点就要冲着应帆大姐前大姐后了。 > >应帆这篇文章是不是也为了验明正身而写：）？ > >泥 怎么误会的？男人就不能谈论胖瘦吗？：） 前些日子衣服换季，突然发现过去的裤子已不能再穿， 多少有点沮丧。曾经以“向前敲瘦骨，犹自带铜声” 自励或者自嘲，如今却找不到合适的字句来形容这份 尴尬。就我本性，还是向往富态的安详，只是习惯已 久形销骨立的螳螂本色，不忍再改。或者，更名为蜘 蛛，做一次夏洛。：） 昨天朋友请客吃火锅，我跟着蹭饭，在座的三位女士 所谈话题基本上都是胖啊瘦的，我插不进嘴，只好猛 吃。现实中我插不进嘴，网上来聊聊，算是出口闷气。：） 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! 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It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 19:18:34 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA26808 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 21:18:34 -0500 Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2000 21:18:34 -0500 Received: (qmail 26957 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 02:34:48 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27058 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 01:59:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 01:59:17 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id JAA03073 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:54:51 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 7 Apr 1999 02:19:05 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA14466 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:51:53 +0800 Message-ID: <001301bf9ea1$c8af05e0$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <0FSI00LOHSBOYM@email.cta.cq.cn> Subject: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 13 [xys_friends] Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:53:47 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 - http://www.xys.org 检讨：大家可能看见我发的那些测试信了吧？因此我特意在此检讨。我的信箱自上周起，发 出的信都无声无息，到昨天才有的退回，有的真正发出去。我那些测试，本以为都没有发出 呢！所以，昨天看到它们后，我真的感到万分的抱歉，可也无法挽回了。请大家原谅。 应帆就是男的嘛，为什么要怀疑:-) 那篇散文很正常嘛。 看到螳螂写的关于女人的谈话的那些话，我觉得螳螂太偏见了:-) 女人岂止爱谈 胖瘦？家庭，自己的孩子，别人的孩子，丈夫的生活习惯，讨论离婚新闻，老婆婆 爱打什么讲究的麻将，丈夫回家的时间一般在几点等等等等，都是她们最爱的话题。 若问我为何这么理解，答案如下：大学里，我们一届的200人中，只有不到40个男生；工作 后，公司的70多名同事里，只有十几个男的。所以一到三八节，我们就爱自豪的说：我们男 的也能顶半边天:-) 下面是我昨天写的： 似曾相识 似曾相识。近来见到什么似乎都有这种感觉。 我知道，人一有了这种感觉，就离变成“遗老”不远了。我自己并不 觉得老，但“遗”的感觉却常有。 每看见电视里的那些“相濡以沫”的演讲者们，总想撑起一把很有诗 意的小伞，可这不过是个错觉而已——到底我的脸上也没有被溅湿半 处，因为那些话并不是冲着我说的，我已经被遗忘了； 走在商店门口，常发现那些“含泪”的标语下耸动着的兴奋抢购的高 跟鞋们。我也想凑过去，但想想还是算了，这倒不是怕被踩伤，而是 因为不管怎样我也买不起那些商品——于是我便主动被遗忘了； 坐在办公室里，那些潮水般一浪高过一浪的声音之外，是毫无表情的， 甘愿被遗忘的我。离我很近的只是冰冷的屏幕，坚硬的键盘，还有变 得很热的鼠标。那时候的我是在操纵着电脑，还是被电脑操纵？ 站在街上，看见远远地刮过一股旋风。可就连旋风到了我附近却也拐 了个弯儿，往别处去了。生活也许总在别处吧，如同昆德拉说的。 如果在什么时候都这么被遗忘，倒也省心。可实际又并非如此。单位 开群众大会时，我必须要参加；街道搞什么统计时，我必须要填表； 坐在公共车里，会有人管我要车钱；搞什么不记名选举时，我一定得 投一票……我似乎还算公众人物哩。 也许生活就是这样。有时你被遗忘，有时则相反。你还想怎么样？ 但是每一天都是这样的生活。这样的生活见得多了，难免会有似曾相 识的感觉。 “似曾相识燕归来”的上一句是什么呢？什么什么花落去吧？ 可春天的花如今还没有开呢。但我已经厌倦了。 2000．4．4晚7：06肖毛 无 可 奈 何 风刮了一天。 泥土，塑料袋，冰淇淋棍，废纸，沙子，破袜子，报纸，壮阳广告， 半截福利彩票，离婚协议书的复印件，寻人启事，恐吓信，讣告， 某机关的废文件等等轻飘飘的东西都轮番在天空里来回飞着。 早晨从区税务局门口过时，一张传单被风卷到身上。拾起来一看， 见上面写着：“税收是共和国的血…”没等看清最后一个字，风 就把我阅读的快乐送上了天。 下班时，刚走到一家饭店的门口，就看到一张扑面而来的广告。 上面写着“烧！烤！涮！本店即日起全面八…”可能这广告有灵 性，知道我不像吃得起饭店的人，所以没等我读完，就跑到身后 那位衣冠楚楚的绅士那里去了。 我忙闭上眼睛。这倒没什么别的原因，只是又起了一阵大风而已。 下了公共汽车，忽然感到累，就想找棵树来靠一靠。四目一望， 这里的树因修路都被砍光了，而我又不想趴在地上，就只好继续 往前晃。 前面怎么那么乱呢？原来工商局的人来收税了；后面怎么也那么 吵呀？哦，原来后面也有工商局的人——真是的，怎么撞到自由 市场里来了？ 冲到一个电话亭旁，忽然想打一个电话，因为那一刻我非常想念 某个朋友。可是插进电话磁卡，拨了一串号码后，我又挂断了电 话。这样反复几次后，我看到身后有一个等着打电话的人，便把 磁卡抽了出来。 “你怎么什么都没说？”那个女人问。 “哦，我只是试试磁卡好不好用。” 再走几步就到家了。可我并不想再走。 我想做的和不想做的事情都很多，可每次都只能想想而已。 风还在狠狠的刮着地皮，搅起那些渣滓来。我还在这条似曾相识的路上…… 2000．4．4晚7：36写；2000.4.5 上午9：37录入 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 4 20:07:53 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA27065 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 22:07:52 -0500 Received: (qmail 18346 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 03:06:26 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 22537 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 03:04:47 -0000 Received: from law-f83.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.146) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 03:04:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 56546 invoked by uid 0); 5 Apr 2000 03:04:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20000405030409.56545.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 132.236.102.169 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:04:09 PDT X-Originating-IP: [132.236.102.169] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 03:04:09 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 14 - http://www.xys.org >>应帆是个女的,可这篇文章中怎么让人 >>男女不分啊. 弄到最后居然要找狭义 >>的女朋友了,让人狐疑 就那一句“我虽然不是要为悦己者容的女孩子”坏菜了。 其实也很通的呀。：( >哈哈，看到一位同我一样“雌雄不辩”的，闹笑话的 >原不止我啊。差点就要冲着应帆大姐前大姐后了。 瞧泥美眉这话说的！我不仅成女的了，还差点儿成大姐了！:) 这以后媳妇还怎么找日子还怎么过？不行不行，一定得帮帮 忙，给我挽回影响。:) >应帆这篇文章是不是也为了验明正身而写：）？ 倒也不是。其实以前经常在文章里提到的，不过人微言轻， 大家没介意罢了。:) 才在新语丝上放了一个自己编的破烂主页，也放了几张 想验明正身的照片，欢迎大家去看看，并提提意见！:) (目前好象要用NETSCAPE才能看，国内的要用代理。) http://www.xys.org/~ying/ 应帆 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 02:21:50 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA28483 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 04:21:50 -0500 Received: (qmail 7762 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 09:38:38 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 17430 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 09:17:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 09:17:38 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.150.88]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSJ0047HDR0J3@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 17:16:13 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 17:22:11 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B0=EB=D4=C2=CC=B8?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSJ0047IDR0J3@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id EAA28483 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 15 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-5 3:04:00 Echo Ying写道： > >才在新语丝上放了一个自己编的破烂主页，也放了几张 >想验明正身的照片，欢迎大家去看看，并提提意见！:) >(目前好象要用NETSCAPE才能看，国内的要用代理。) > >http://www.xys.org/~ying/ > > >应帆 新语丝还没解冻。真够气人的。 应帆不妨在国内申请一个免费的网页存放点。最近网易搞 了个可以申请100M空间的活动（http://go.163.com）， 虽然奇慢无比，但可以方便没代理服务器的网友。 我刚申请了一个，没怎么打理，先放在那儿。 http://tl99.yeah.net 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 04:24:42 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA28786 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 06:24:42 -0500 Received: (qmail 2053 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 11:23:14 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 1810 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 11:26:10 -0000 Received: from mail.ttlc.net (208.130.9.4) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 11:26:09 -0000 Received: from msp [206.151.172.38] by mail.ttlc.net (SMTPD32-6.00) id A2B7AFB900E6; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 07:25:43 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000405065547.007bfe30@mail.ttlc.net> X-Sender: yige@mail.ttlc.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 06:55:47 -0700 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: yige Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: [xys friends] 半月谈 In-Reply-To: <0FSI00LOHSBOYM@email.cta.cq.cn> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 17 - http://www.xys.org >前些日子衣服换季，突然发现过去的裤子已不能再穿， >多少有点沮丧。曾经以“向前敲瘦骨，犹自带铜声” >自励或者自嘲，如今却找不到合适的字句来形容这份 >尴尬。就我本性，还是向往富态的安详，只是习惯已 俺寺里目前还能敲出铜声来的，大概也就剩古平和舟子了。 不愧是网上元老，养生有方。想想俺以前，在单位的减肥 食堂吃饭，肚子里哪里有油水？每次工资一到手，就馋得 不行，于是就赶紧跑去杭州酒家点一钵东坡肉，这是道工 夫菜，至少得等上二十分钟才能出菜，所以是培养口水和 感情的大好时光，等肉终于上桌后，夹起一块如嫩豆腐般 颤悠悠的大块肉送进嘴里化了，哇塞！过毒瘾大概也不过 如此。现在不行喽，即便是偶尔吃一次鸡，也要如奉命剥 皮揎草的刽子手般先将整张鸡皮仔仔细细剥了，除此之外， 每天吃东西还要掰着指头算卡路里，一超过两千卡就赶紧 去跑步，这过得是什么日子！就这样，俺的裤腰还是大了 三寸。所以，目前只能以“向前拍肥肚，犹自喜开颜”而 自慰。 亦歌 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 05:39:49 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA29042 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 07:39:49 -0500 Received: (qmail 15170 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 12:38:23 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12591 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 12:41:09 -0000 Received: from web221.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.121) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 12:41:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20000405123631.11461.rocketmail@web221.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.8.40] by web221.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 05 Apr 2000 05:36:31 PDT Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 05:36:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: [xys friends] 半月谈 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 18 - http://www.xys.org --- yige wrote: > 俺寺里目前还能敲出铜声来的，大概也就剩古平和舟子了。 > 不愧是网上元老，养生有方。想想俺以前，在单位的减肥 > 那是养的吗？是因为日理万机。 “读书论坛”可以用代理服务器上。 附一篇介绍文章。具体的代理服务器就不公布了，省 得被封掉。 《有关代理服务器的几个问题》 一、为什么要使用代理服务器？ 原因有以下几个： 1.加快上网的速度，这点在中国大陆，有特别明 显的作为，比如上 http: //altavista.digital.com/ ，我试过几个ISP，还是用国外的代 理服务器比直接在国内上来得快。 2.获取某些被封网站的资讯，比如说香港的 《明报》http://www.mingpao.com/newspaper/index.htm、 《星岛日报》http://www.singtao.com/、 《苹果日报》http://www.appledaily.com.hk/apple.cgi 、 《壹周刊》http://www.nextmedia.com.hk/nm/等， 国内的很多的ISP都有封网的恶习，实在是无聊之极。 3.进行匿名访问，如果你不想让别人知道你从那 里来，想到那里去，使 用代理服务器吧，保护你的私隐！ 二、PROXY基本设置方法： 1、NETSCAPE NAVIGATOR下的设置（以4.0以上版本为例）： 选择EDIT下的Preferences,双击左边的Category栏 中的 Advanced项，在其下选择 Proxies ,右边即出现proxy 的设置栏，有以下三个选项： Direct connection to the Internet（直接连通Internet） Manual proxy configuration （手动设置proxy） Automatic proxy configuration （自动设置proxy） 选择中间的 Manual proxy configuration ，同时按旁边的 View 按钮，即出现一个 Mannual proxy configuration的 窗口，在HTTP一栏中填上 offler.router.easynet.net ，在旁边的 port 填上 8080 ，按 OK ，即完成设置。 此后，输入网址连接一个站点时，会首先连接proxy中转站 然后再连至目的站点，由于代理服务器通常cache了大量站 点的内容资料，因而速度有一定提高，当然，各 个国家地区 的速度会有所不同，可选择不同的proxy进行连接。如果你想 取消使用proxy，请选择 Direct connection to Internet即可 2、IE4.0下的设置（以中文版为例）： 选择 查看 下的 Internet选项 ，在上边选 连接 ，在下面出 现的窗口中选择中间的 通过代理服务器访问Internet ，再选 取[高级]选项，在 HTTP 类型那行将代理服务器地址一栏填上 offler.router.easynet.net ，端口 填上 8080 , 按[确定]即完成设置。 此后，输入网址连接一个站点时，会首先连接proxy中转站 然后再连至目的站点，由于代理服务器通常cache了大量站 点的内容资料，因而速度有一定提高，当然，各个国家地区 的速度会有所不同，可选择不同的proxy进行连接。如果你想 取消使用proxy，请取消选择 通过代理服务器访问Internet 即可。 三、选择更快的proxy 由于不同的ISP、不同的目标网址以及在不同的时间里，代理服务器的速度 也不一样。加上代理服务器随时可能被关闭。所 以，经常寻找、检测、选择 和更换更快的代理服务器是必要的。在网上有一 个软件叫代理猎手（Proxy Hunter), 是寻找和检测代理服务器的好帮手。大家可在一 些软件站点找到这个软件。 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 09:01:08 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA29867 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 11:01:07 -0500 Received: (qmail 8403 invoked by uid 7797); 5 Apr 2000 16:05:18 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 23362 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 15:58:16 -0000 Received: from public.bta.net.cn (202.96.0.97) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 15:58:16 -0000 Received: from xiaolan (bt-209-005.bta.net.cn [202.106.209.5]) by public.bta.net.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA24235 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:53:56 +0800 (GMT) Message-ID: <006401bf9f17$7e0cde60$05d16aca@xiaolan> From: "Yu_He_Zhi" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?s8HJ+sH5vMejraOtv7S1+rzHxd4=?= Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 23:55:04 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 19 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 沉生六记 之看碟记呸 事情是这样的－－今天回家有点晚了（这点很重要，我一定是撞见鬼了），我在回 家的路上遇到一群影碟贩子，忽然记起来什么《美国美人》刚获了大奖，这之前又听到 有人评价曰：胜券在握－－较诸同侪，遥遥在前云云。于是随口问了一句有没有。立时 就有一位手举着一张盘直冲了过来：“获了奥斯卡大奖哩！卖得好火哟！只剩这一张了 ！”不得了，不得了，我赶紧递上钱，以便回家也跟上潮流。拿过盘来还没收好。听那 汉子又说哩：“获了奥斯卡大奖哩！卖得好火哟！只剩这一张了！”咦，赶情他的鼻孔 和四四格的一样大，也是有回音的？转过头一看，不是呀，原来是说给另一个买主听 哩，当然手里拿着同样一张盘。 回家正襟危坐，观赏大片......“什么玩艺儿！”谁说的？！谁？旗杆上插鸡毛－ －好大的掸子！什么玩艺儿？好玩艺儿呗！洋人说好了，美人也说好了，聪明人也说好 了，我虽苯得下愚不移，跟着说好还是会的，《聪明知识小手册》第26页上明明白白写 着呢。 回头看见《聪明学高级教程》正摊在桌上，最上面一页说：“对于原则上需要说好 的时候，一定要毫不犹豫，毫不迟疑，发自肺腑，九转回肠，挺胸鼓腹，下透三焦，喷 薄而出，中气实足！”哇，果然大气，连叫好都是胜世元音，带着浓郁的五谷轮回的味 道－－我是没有指望学会了，只希望若是遇到聪明人叫好的时候，能远远地屏住呼吸， 静静地聆听。 不过欢呼还是会的，先预演一下，－－为《美国美人》获得大奖欢呼“呜－－呸 ！”错了，错了，怎么呸了，应该是乌拉才对，再来一遍：“阿－－呸！”，错得更离 谱了，再来再来：“呀呀！呸！”怎么回事，看完碟怎么只会说呸了。撞见鬼了，怎么 能说呸呢，《聪明大辞典》第一一六三七页第三栏斩钉截铁地写着：说“呸”是愚蠢、 粗俗、没教养、专愚、低趣味、没品味等的最直接标志。我一定是撞见鬼了，我虽然 笨，但笨得有分寸，还有前途，也许终有一日可以离开下愚不移这个考语，而上升一个 等级，比如说如果哪位肯在我死后，为我写神道碑时写道：“他是一个愚不可及的人 ！”我一定会高兴得从坟里坐起来。 然而现在，我可怎么办呢？给人们知道我堕落到会说：“呸”，将来连抬棺材的人 都请不到了。天哪，我真的好惨，生前没坐过四人抬的绿泥轿，死后连四人抬的阴沉木 也享受不到了。要是他们知道我对获了大奖的《美国美人》说呸，哦，光是想一想就够 吓人了，赶紧写遗嘱罢，那么多的洋人，美人，聪明人，半洋人，准美人，似聪明人， 一齐用鼻子冷笑，那声波一齐叠加在我身上，足以把我震成原子微粒了！ 呀，死到临头了，即使是伪装得好，竭力想瞒下去，也是躲了初一，躲不了十五。 就算这个不露陷，还保不齐有其它的漏子呢！皇帝陛下请了两位异国的织匠，用了生丝 和真金为他作了一件彩霞一样美的礼服，雪花一样轻柔，聪明人们交口称赞着，万一我 在观看礼服游行上又鬼上身了呢，只要开口说：“陛下，这个月份不适合天体运动。” 一准人头落地！ “撒豆驱鬼法”，看来只有试一下这个了： “福里边！鬼外边！” 庾荷芝 于为买碟的十五元肉痛欲绝之际 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 16:29:07 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA31877 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 18:29:07 -0500 Received: (qmail 24370 invoked by uid 108); 5 Apr 2000 23:27:39 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 17646 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2000 23:08:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2000 23:08:35 -0000 Received: from p2 by mail.qdcatv.com.cn with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 07:00:27 +0800 Message-ID: <002b01bf9f4f$a1ac0020$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000405123631.11461.rocketmail@web221.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?UmU6IFt4eXNfZnJpZW5kc10gUmU6IFt4eXMgZnJpZW5kc10gsOvUwsy4?= Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 06:38:12 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 20 - http://www.xys.org - http://www.xys.org > 由于不同的ISP、不同的目标网址以及在不同的时间里，代理服务器的速度 > 也不一样。加上代理服务器随时可能被关闭。所 > 以，经常寻找、检测、选择 > 和更换更快的代理服务器是必要的。在网上有一 > 个软件叫代理猎手（Proxy Hunter), > 是寻找和检测代理服务器的好帮手。大家可在一 > 些软件站点找到这个软件。 > 使用用软件找出来的代理服务器是有争议的。因为大部分用这种方法找出来 的代理服务器，通常是某个公司内部网的主机，人家并没打算让自己的机器 成为代理服务器。只是因为技术人员的疏忽，没有采取任何安全措施，被你 给找到的。如果被发现了的话，有吃官司的危险，这可是有先例的。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 18:09:38 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA32205 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 20:09:37 -0500 Received: (qmail 21691 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 01:08:20 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 379 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 01:05:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 01:05:21 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.153.200]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSK00B8HLK57T@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 09:02:31 +0800 (CST) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 09:08:29 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: [xys_friends] =B3=C1=C9=FA=C1=F9=BC=C7=A3=AD=A3=AD=BF=B4=B5=FA=BC=C7=C5=DE?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSK00B8ILK67T@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id UAA32205 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 21 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-5 23:55:00 Yu_He_Zhi写道： > > “撒豆驱鬼法”，看来只有试一下这个了： > > “福里边！鬼外边！” 撒豆驱鬼真的是这样的吗？是不是咒语有误？：） > > 庾荷芝 > 于为买碟的十五元肉痛欲绝之际 > 庾荷芝买的是在电影院里偷录的那种碟子吧。：）看那种碟子 真是一种折磨，我曾经看过一篇文章，说盗亦有道，即便是在 电影院里偷录，也要有职业精神，比如至少要把镜头摆正吧， 至少不能边录边吃苞米花吧，若傍边总有个女孩咭咭偷笑，至 少要考虑换个位置再录吧。 不过这种迷离若即的现场感觉，是LD版的碟子不能给予的。赋 格推崇的王家卫，风格几近于此。 这“美国美人”（一华另有一译似叫“玫瑰畸情”）我还没看， 想来和“英国病人”差不多，说它好的好的不得了，说它差的 能在电影院里酣然入睡，醒来后勃然大怒。 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 18:48:25 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA32457 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 20:48:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 7377 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 01:46:58 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 20621 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 01:45:21 -0000 Received: from hp735crx.tori.me.ynu.ac.jp (133.34.48.69) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 01:45:21 -0000 Received: from simba (coopn2.crd.ynu.ac.jp [133.34.39.72]) by hp735crx.tori.me.ynu.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W) with SMTP id GAA05120 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 06:23:18 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <006401bf9fb4$e94c61d0$48272285@simba> From: "Simba lee" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <0FSK00B8ILK67T@email.cta.cq.cn> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?UmU6IFt4eXMgZnJpZW5kc12zwcn6wfm8x6Oto62/tLX6vMfF3g==?= Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 11:43:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 22 - http://www.xys.org 这大概是周作人写的日本人驱鬼的咒语。 用什么豆子？绿豆还是炒焦的黄豆吧。 ----- Original Message ----- From: tanglang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 2:08 AM Subject: Re: [xys friends]沉生六记－－看碟记呸 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-5 23:55:00 Yu_He_Zhi写道： > > “撒豆驱鬼法”，看来只有试一下这个了： > > “福里边！鬼外边！” 撒豆驱鬼真的是这样的吗？是不是咒语有误？：） > > 庾荷芝 > 于为买碟的十五元肉痛欲绝之际 > 庾荷芝买的是在电影院里偷录的那种碟子吧。：）看那种碟子 真是一种折磨，我曾经看过一篇文章，说盗亦有道，即便是在 电影院里偷录，也要有职业精神，比如至少要把镜头摆正吧， 至少不能边录边吃苞米花吧，若傍边总有个女孩咭咭偷笑，至 少要考虑换个位置再录吧。 不过这种迷离若即的现场感觉，是LD版的碟子不能给予的。赋 格推崇的王家卫，风格几近于此。 这“美国美人”（一华另有一译似叫“玫瑰畸情”）我还没看， 想来和“英国病人”差不多，说它好的好的不得了，说它差的 能在电影院里酣然入睡，醒来后勃然大怒。 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 5 19:48:25 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA00338 for ; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 21:48:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 5 Apr 2000 21:48:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 29318 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 02:46:56 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 25427 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 02:44:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 02:44:50 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id KAA04266 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:44:00 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 8 Apr 1999 03:08:16 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA12152 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:41:00 +0800 Message-ID: <000901bf9f71$d4933040$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 23 [xys_friends] Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:43:02 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 - http://www.xys.org > > 庾荷芝买的是在电影院里偷录的那种碟子吧。：）看那种碟子 > 真是一种折磨，我曾经看过一篇文章，说盗亦有道，即便是在 > 电影院里偷录，也要有职业精神，比如至少要把镜头摆正吧， > 至少不能边录边吃苞米花吧，若傍边总有个女孩咭咭偷笑，至 > 少要考虑换个位置再录吧。 > :我买过一种凯奇主演的《天使之城》，就是这种版本。里面没人 在笑，却一直有人咳嗽——天使都感冒了吗？ 我还买过一种《八厘米》，那里总有鬼影在晃来晃去。后来，弄到 一种真正碟版的，可是看起来还觉得镜头摇晃——心理作用吗:-) ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 01:13:32 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA01426 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 03:13:31 -0500 Received: (qmail 7980 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 08:12:13 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 21612 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 08:10:09 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 08:10:09 -0000 Received: from default (putc1218008.cts.com [209.68.218.8]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA49120 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 01:10:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000406010620.007eebc0@mail.funtv.com> X-Sender: sfang@mail.funtv.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 01:06:20 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 陈村上网聊天（转） Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 24 - http://www.xys.org 今晚（4月6日北京时间）19：00-21：00 本人出现在搜狐聊天室，欢迎前来捧场：） 陈村 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 06:12:05 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA02259 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 08:12:04 -0500 Received: (qmail 11747 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 13:29:32 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 22677 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 13:06:01 -0000 Received: from public.bta.net.cn (202.96.0.97) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 13:06:01 -0000 Received: from xiaolan (bt-209-038.bta.net.cn [202.106.209.38]) by public.bta.net.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA04189 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 20:56:36 +0800 (GMT) Message-ID: <000b01bf9fc7$e00b2bc0$22d16aca@xiaolan> From: "Yu_He_Zhi" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <3.0.6.32.20000406010620.007eebc0@mail.funtv.com> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?zt7W0Mn609A=?= Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 20:54:56 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01BFA00A.5DB4A460" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 25 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BFA00A.5DB4A460 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0007_01BFA00A.5DC56D40" ------=_NextPart_001_0007_01BFA00A.5DC56D40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit - http://www.xys.org 《科学》杂志是我上学时最爱看的杂志之一，两个月前去书店看到那上面的文章分 类结集出版了，于是就买了一种《数学游戏》（两册），作为午间休息的读物，结果看 了一篇就卡住了，书上也没有明示原委，直到今天上午有个同事看后，才道破的。我想 还有点意思，贴出来瞧瞧。－－数学高才不要笑，其他事先不知道的可以作为脑筋急转 弯。 图扫描得不好，凑合看罢。 如附图所示，一个正方形如所示分割，再组成一个矩形，这个矩形的面积增大了一 个单位。 庾荷芝 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb ------=_NextPart_001_0007_01BFA00A.5DC56D40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable - http://www.xys.org

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AooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKAC iiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKAP/9k= ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BFA00A.5DB4A460-- From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 06:50:13 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA02420 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 08:50:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 6807 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 13:49:00 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18804 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 13:51:38 -0000 Received: from f264.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.240.139) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 13:51:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 93030 invoked by uid 0); 6 Apr 2000 13:46:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20000406134656.93029.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 208.7.177.84 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 06:46:56 PDT X-Originating-IP: [208.7.177.84] From: "Ping Koo" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] ~{N^VPIzSP~} Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 06:46:56 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 26 - http://www.xys.org calculate the tan values of the two larger angles, they are not same. So, the extra 1 unit cames from gaps. koo >From: "Yu_He_Zhi" >Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >Subject: [xys_friends] ~{N^VPIzSP~} >Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 20:54:56 +0800 > > - http://www.xys.org > > >~{!6?FQ'!7TSV>JGNRIOQ'J1Wn0.?45DTSV>V.R;#,A=8vTBG0H%Ji5j?45=DGIOCf5DNDUB7V~} >~{@`=aMBrAKR;VV!6J}Q'SNO7!7#(A=2a#)#,WwN*Ng~{AKR;F*>M?(W!AK#,JiIOR2C;SPCwJ>T-N/#,V15==qLlIONgSP8vM,JB?4:s#,2E5@FF5D!#NROk~} >~{;9SP5cRbK<#,Ly3v@4GFGF!##-#-J}Q'8_2E2;R*P&#,FdK{JBOH2;V*5@5D?IRTWwN*DT=n<1W*~} >~{Md!#~} > ~{M > >~{Hg8=M#,R;8vU}7=PNHgKyJ>7V8n#,TYWi3IR;8v>XPN#,Ub8v>XPN5DCf;}Tv4sAKR;~} >~{8v5%N;!#~} > > > ~{bW:IV%~} > > > >______________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com >Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! 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It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 07:38:41 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA02622 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 09:38:40 -0500 Received: (qmail 10192 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 14:37:13 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 917 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 14:35:51 -0000 Received: from turing.mathworks.com (HELO smtp.mathworks.com) (144.212.95.101) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 14:35:51 -0000 Received: from goose.mathworks.com (goose.mathworks.com [144.212.95.120]) by smtp.mathworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA19474 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:35:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost by goose.mathworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA29707 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:35:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: goose.mathworks.com: zhiping owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 10:35:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Zhiping You To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?zt7W0Mn609A=?= In-Reply-To: <000b01bf9fc7$e00b2bc0$22d16aca@xiaolan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="-559023410-851401618-955031702=:29681" Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 27 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. Send mail to mime@docserver.cac.washington.edu for more info. ---559023410-851401618-955031702=:29681 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE - http://www.xys.org Here's a similar one.=20 Look at the attached gif file before you read the following proof. Have fun. =A3=AD=A3=AD=CD=F2=BE=AB=D3=CD=A3=AD=A3=AD -------------------------------------------- Proof that all angles are right angles=20 Draw a square ABCD. Draw a line CE so that E is not equal to D and so that the length of CE is equal to the length of the sides of the square. Draw line AE. Since AE and DA are not parallel, their perpendicular bisectors (in green) intersect in a unique point F. Draw lines FA, FB, FC and FE. Lines FB and FC (in red) have equal lengths since F lies on the perp. sector of BC. Similarly, lines FA and FE (in blue) have equal lengths since F lies on the perp. bisector of AE. Lines EC and AB have equal lengths by construction. Hence triangle ABF is congruent to triangle ECF by side-side-side equality. Hence the angle ABF equals the angle ECF. Hence the angle ABC equals the angle ECB. Since the angle ECB is arbitrary it follows all angles are equal to right angles. QED. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb ---559023410-851401618-955031702=:29681 Content-Type: IMAGE/GIF; name="paradox.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64 Content-ID: Content-Description: Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="paradox.gif" R0lGODlh4AKNAvcAAP///wAAAACAAP8AAAAA/wAAAFtbW21tbYCAgJKSkqSk pLa2tsjIyNvb2+3t7f///zMAAE0AAGYAAIAAAJkAALMAAMwAAOYAAP8AAP8d Hf86Ov9XV/91df+Skv+vr//MzDMRAEoZAGAgAHcoAI4vAKQ3ALs+ANJGAOhN AP9VAP9sIv+CRP+ZZv+wiP/Gqv/dzDMiAEoxAGBAAHdPAI5eAKRuALt9ANKM AOibAP+qAP+1Iv/BRP/MZv/XiP/jqv/uzDMzAEdHAFxcAHBwAIWFAJmZAK2t AMLCANbWAOvrAP//AP//Kf//Uv//ev//o///zCIzADFKAEBgAE93AF6OAG6k AH27AIzSAJvoAKr/ALX/IsH/RMz/Ztf/iOP/qu7/zBEzABpNACJmACuAADOZ ADyzAETMAE3mAFX/AGj/HXz/Oo//V6P/dbb/ksr/r93/zAAzAABQAABtAACK AACoAADFAADiAAD/ABr/GjP/M03/TWb/ZoD/gJn/mbP/s8z/zAAzEQBNGgBm 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dhtSWtaCW6m25o4b4LfkFksQuuuKmuW52mao7rscfeWuvYzma5O8zCJWr74Y IcWvwHEWTJ2/y67ZkbTr5oSwwWVGfJ7CC2slcUYQZ8zxXR3fOpHFzRrMEsUf m3nyYH2KHKiRFpmcMpAwi+mwVSz/idvLMe9c0Mx25nhzy0YR4DPPKBZ9qL1B F2d0004/DXXUUk9NddVWX4111lpvPdpEXH8N9rMUIR122Waf5hLZZ6/NNnEX tw133DTypLbcTilVt90TGzirt4Nh5d134ILP9Pfghh8uXeGIL8442nw3Dnnk xr0teeWWX4555ppvznnnnn8Oeuiij0566ewFBAA7 ---559023410-851401618-955031702=:29681-- From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 10:20:22 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA03501 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 12:20:21 -0500 Received: (qmail 23844 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 17:18:54 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 14396 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2000 17:21:54 -0000 Received: from mail.uninet.com.cn (202.96.197.11) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2000 17:21:54 -0000 Received: from default ([202.101.34.205]) by mail.uninet.com.cn (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA3334050 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 01:16:04 +0900 (CDT) Message-Id: <200004061616.BAA3334050@mail.uninet.com.cn> Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 1:17:41 +0800 From: Zhou Yihua To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: Re: [xys_friends] 无中生有 X-mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [en] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 28 - http://www.xys.org At 00-4-6 10:35:00, you wrote: >Draw a square ABCD. Draw a line CE so that E is not equal to D and so that >the length of CE is equal to the length of the sides of the square. Draw >line AE. Since AE and DA are not parallel, their perpendicular bisectors >(in green) intersect in a unique point F. Draw lines FA, FB, FC and FE. F在ABCD内。 一华 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 14:59:01 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA04657 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 16:59:00 -0500 Received: (qmail 7443 invoked by uid 7797); 6 Apr 2000 22:03:32 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 11522 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 07:25:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 07:25:37 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id PAA02044 for ; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 15:13:57 -0700 Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA3095 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:30:30 +0800 Message-ID: <002d01bf9d14$d8426580$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 10:32:22 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 29 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 《朗读者》想要告诉我们什么 ——驳《情于斯，悲于斯》一文中的某些观点 （注：《朗读者》，德国 本哈德·施林克著，姚仲珍译，译文刊载于 2000年第二期《译林》杂志。小说情节大概如下：15岁的少年米夏尔 偶遇36岁的售票员汉娜，后两人发生了性关系。汉娜喜欢米夏尔给她 阅读文学名著，但后来又神秘的失踪。米夏尔上大学后，二战已经结 束，作为学法律的学生在法庭旁听的他，发现了作为纳粹集中营看守 受审的汉娜等人。这时才猜到汉娜当初喜欢听自己朗读的原因，那是 因为她并不识字。也正为此，她才神秘失踪，并做了看守。米夏尔想 告诉法官这实情，因为这可以救汉娜，但终于没有。后来，汉娜被判 无期徒刑。米夏尔从此就在家里给她朗读文学作品，然后给她寄到监 狱里，给了汉娜生活的勇气。汉娜也在狱中学会了阅读和写字，开始 反思战争。18年后，汉娜被特赦出狱。可就在出狱的那天早晨，汉娜 自杀了……此书1995年在德国出版，后被译成22国文字。作者生于 1944年，当过法官和大学教授。） 看了今年第二期《译林》杂志上的德国作家本哈德的小说《朗读者》后， 我的心灵受到了很大的震动，本想就此写一篇读书笔记。可是看罢这一 期杂志上题为《情于斯，悲于斯》的书评后，却一点儿写笔记的兴趣也 没有了，只想在下面的批驳中阐述一下我的部分浅见。（我不否认那篇 书评里有些说的很对的地方。） （一） 小说为何名为《朗读者》 那篇书评的作者问：“…为什么要把分明是个爱情故事的小说，取个 《朗读者》的书名呢？” 我看这问句和接下去的解答都是很幼稚的，这说明书评的作者根本没 有看懂这本有着严肃主题的小说。 让我们先来看两段小说的译文吧： “朗读的缺点是它持续的时间较长，但是，正因为如此它才使朗读者把 内容深深地铭刻在脑子里。至今我对一些内容仍记忆犹新。” “…在朗读时，我能发现我的感觉正确与否。如果不正确，我可以重新 再来，把旧的去掉，重新录制。但是，我不喜欢这样做，我想用朗读来 画个圆满的句号。” 所以说，在本书里“朗读”其实是个象征，用来象征人与人之间美好感 情的公开交流——这种交流当然也包括爱情，但绝不仅仅是指爱情的交 流——也象征着对战争的反思等等。 也正因此，小说的名字只应该叫《朗读者》，因为作者不想让它成为所 谓的“爱情故事的小说”，也不想借此控诉什么“连性爱都不允许存在” 的社会。 （二） 汉娜与米夏尔的爱情说明了什么 两人间的爱情悲剧和“某些政治上的原因”并没有什么直接关系。以常 识来看，这种爱情在哪个社会里都是不正常，也难有好结果的，谈不上 社会是否“允许”的问题。因为15岁的少年生理上虽然成熟了，但心理 上却不是，并不懂得爱情。米夏尔不正是这样吗？他只有在完全长大后 才渐渐明白了什么才是爱情。所以对他们的爱情我们应该理解，却不应 该提倡，更不必荒谬地把悲剧归罪于社会。小说是想由此挖掘出汉娜的 悲剧产生的原因之一而已。 而且，这也是个很复杂的问题，一味将其归之于“政治扼杀”，并因此 而发出“性爱自由”之类的感叹是错误的——书评作者这么看，不但是 理解错误，也可能是由于缺乏正确理解能力的原因。 （三） 本书何以会引起强烈的共鸣 我想是因为它能引起我们对战争以及人性的深刻反思的缘故。 请看下面的三段译文： “我们都谴责我们的父母是可耻的…因为1945年之后他们容忍了他们周 围的罪犯。” “我们——肇事者的后代，仅仅感到那段历史是骇人听闻…就可以了吗？” “当我们把罪犯，受害者，死亡者，活着的人，幸存者和永垂不朽者相 互比较时，我就感到不舒服。过去感到不舒服，现在仍然感到不舒服。 允许人们这样比较吗？” 如果明白了这三段话的内涵，那么作者为何写这部小说，它引起人们共 鸣的原因我们就都基本清楚了。 这些话有三个层次的含义：第一，战争过后，我们还要“审判”容忍了 战争的人；第二，除了“审判”，更要深刻的反思；第三，人类既是战 争的发动者，又是其受害者，所以只要曾生活在战争里的人，都该良心 不安，不管他是否犯下了实际罪行。 （四） 汉娜有罪吗 光在思想上反思是不够的。那么，我们在现实里该怎么做？当然要审判 战争的罪人，即战犯了。 那么战犯的外延到底有多远？战犯何以成为战犯？光是审判就可以消除 战争给人带来的伤害吗？谁又有资格判决，法官还是法律？这些就是米 夏尔在观看对汉娜等人的审判时引发的更深一层的思考。 具体往下看之前，我想先借法国作家皮埃尔·布尔的小说《桂河桥》来 说明一下。《桂河桥》里的英国军官尼科尔森上校在我们看来是英雄还 是战争罪人？他为什么在自己的部队里与在日本战俘营里一样的尽职尽 责？战争对他到底意味着什么？看过那本书的人自然明白，战争对上校 来说，似乎是一种职业，而上校本人是完全敬业的。尽管我们希望他成 为烈士，可是看完全书后心里又隐约觉得上校的举动是对的。 也许我该再结合法国作家米歇尔·图尔尼埃的小说《榿木王》谈一下， 但为节省篇幅，只好不再多说了。现在我们再来看看汉娜：她到底有没 有罪？ 对她来说，西门子的工作和集中营看守的工作都是没有区别的职业，因 为她不明白战争，所以她才选择了看守的工作。（当然，更因为她不识 字的缘故——这里不是我谈论的范畴。）不可否认，她在战争中做了帮 凶，可比起真正的战争罪犯，她的罪是微不足道的，甚至可以说没有。 何况，她也是战争的受害者。从这角度上说，判她无期太重了。 那么，什么人该重判呢？是真正的战犯，还有那些逃避了惩罚的战争罪 人。而即便这些人也全都得到了判决，我们的心里就能因此而平静了吗？ 这也是作者需要我们和他一起思考的问题。我们读此书时，该把注意力 集中在这些思考上，而不是着迷于什么所谓“性渴望”这样的浅层次上。 （五） 幸存者的女儿表情为何僵硬 那篇书评中认为：集中营的那个幸存者的女儿“在明白了自己冤枉了汉 娜时，竟没有丝毫的表情显现，以至使米夏尔认为她脸部的表情从早年 开始就这样僵硬。除此之外，还有什么可以解释的呢？” 下面我就来做一个另外的解释。 让我们将心比心的设想一下，一个花季的少女在集中营里经过惨无人道 的折磨后，肉体和心灵会受到多大的创伤？此后她还能再微笑吗？她对 战争的仇恨能轻易的消失吗？战争的罪恶给她带来的痛苦是永不能被弥 补和原谅的。她的仇恨表面上看是针对汉娜的，其实是针对整个战争本 身。所以她对汉娜谈不上原谅不原谅，自然也不能接受她的忏悔了。可 书评的作者却要求她原谅汉娜，真是可笑，他们以为她是女基督吗？换 了你们，你们能原谅吗？书评的作者甚至还指责她表情的“僵硬”，这 就更不能让人接受了。 小说里有关“僵硬”的那句话是这样说的：“…也许是由于她早年的痛 苦经历使其如此僵硬。”这意思和“米夏尔认为她脸部的表情从早年开 始就这样僵硬”完全不同。一句是充满同情和无奈的叙述，一句是冷冷 的，带有挖苦意味的叙述——这两者的意思能一样吗？ 书评作者这样理解，不但说明其中文理解能力的差劲，更说明他们自己 毫无该有的同情心。 所以，我们没有理由和资格让这个幸存者的女儿原谅战争和汉娜，也没 理由把汉娜的罪过看得那么深，但我们有理由反思战争的根源，力争避 免它的再次出现。 （六） 《朗读者》开给我们的药方 但是我们要怎么做才能避免战争悲剧的再次发生？回头再看我在本文开 头引用的两段关于朗读的译文，就可以猜到作者对此开给我们的药方： 朗读。朗读，把这悲剧大声的朗读出来！ 这样才可以让战争造成的悲剧“深深地铭刻在脑子里”，让我们在朗读 时发现“感觉正确与否”，“用朗读来画个圆满的句号。” 这种朗读，不只是读给德国人听的，也是读给整个人类听的。这样一来， 才可能真的打消我们想要发动战争的念头，如果借用美国作家怀特在 《小老鼠斯图亚特》P94页里的话来解释，这种朗读可以使我们“Absolutely no being mean，”即连战争的念也不要有——这当然是美好的幻想， 但我们应该这么幻想。汉娜的自杀更加深了我们的这种幻想的信念。 可是书评作者却用他们那看似漂亮，实际却多处经不起推敲的书评把 读者引上了邪路，这不但是玷污了这部深刻的作品，也玷污了人类的美好精神。 顺便说一句，那篇书评里也有错误的字句。如“平白无故的汉娜”一词 应该为“平白无辜的汉娜”才对。 （七） 关于《朗读者》的译文 这部小说的译文非常上乘，是近年少见的好译文。让我在这里以读者 的身份对译者表示感谢和敬意！可惜，译文里有两处值得商榷的地方。 一是这句：“空气回荡，街道热得闪闪发光”。我觉得，“热”的结 果似乎不能说“发光”。二是这句：“用一根棍子响响地敲打着铁栅 栏的栏杆。”这里，“响响地”一词用得不大妥当。 2000．4．1下午1：45写；2000.4.3. 上午10:10录 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 14:59:50 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA04673 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 16:59:50 -0500 Received: (qmail 8418 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 21:58:20 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 9429 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 08:34:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 08:34:06 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.156.36]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSH00F9YH12FP@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:31:52 +0800 (CST) Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 16:37:47 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: [xys_friends] brain To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSH00F9ZH13FP@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id QAA04673 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 30 - http://www.xys.org 科学家破译天才大脑之秘 ( April 04, 2000, 01:15 PM ) 　　1999年底，世界各大媒体纷纷推出千年风云人物，与马克思一样，爱因 斯坦名列第一或第二。其中英国《物理世界》杂志评选出了有史以来10名最 杰出的物理学家，名列榜首的是"相对论之父"爱因斯坦。在人们的眼里，这 些大科学家都是天才，他们的大脑与常人的大脑到底有什么不同？这一问题 一直吸引着研究人员和普通人，然而这些天才中只有爱因斯坦留下了大脑标 本，因此研究爱因斯坦大脑的机会更显得珍贵了。 　　1955年4月18日爱因斯坦在美国普林斯顿逝世，享年76岁。按照爱因斯 坦的遗愿，爱因斯坦的家属立即请来了哈维医生为爱因斯坦的遗体做解剖。 在爱因斯坦逝世7小时后，哈维医生将爱因斯坦的大脑取出，并做了防腐处 理。此后数年，在对爱因斯坦大脑的重量、体积、尺寸、外观等进行测量、 记录和研究后，哈维医生与其他研究人员将爱因斯坦大脑切割成240小块进 行仔细分析。 　　爱因斯坦的大脑一直由哈维医生保管，与此同时，哈维医生也一直在寻 找对研究爱因斯坦的大脑感兴趣，并有责任心和研究能力的人。1995年，哈 维终于找到了在加拿大麦克马斯特大学工作的女教授威特尔森，并将爱因斯 坦的大脑转交给威特尔森教授保管和研究。哈维选中威特尔森的主要原因是 她对大脑有非常深的研究，并拥有了约150个正常人的大脑标本，这样她可 以对爱因斯坦的大脑进行对比分析。 　　爱因斯坦的大脑研究曾一度激起人们的浓厚兴趣。但早先的很多研究显 示，这位物理学大师的大脑重量与常人无异。就是在爱因斯坦大脑被切割 成240小块后，专家们也未发现其与普通大脑有何明显不同。然而，当威特 尔森接手研究爱因斯坦的大脑后，却做出了惊人的发现：爱因斯坦的大脑宽 度显著超常。研究人员认为，这一发现可能有助于解释爱因斯坦为什么在空 间和数学思维方面具有特殊天才。 　　威特尔森等人的研究是迄今对爱因斯坦大脑解剖结构所作的最详尽分析 。威特尔森教授在研究中发现，爱因斯坦的大脑在两方面与常人显著不同。 　　首先是爱因斯坦大脑左右半球的顶下叶区域异常发达，比普通人的平均 厚度多出一厘米，这造成爱因斯坦大脑宽度超过普通人15％左右。研究人员 指出，位于大脑后上部的顶下叶区在视觉空间认知、数学思维和运动想象力 方面发挥着重要作用，该区域的异常发达在一定程度上可解释为什么爱因斯 坦会形成自己独特的思维方式。爱因斯坦本人就曾描述说，他的科学思维过 程具有较强视觉性，而语言在其中所起的作用似乎不大。 　　爱因斯坦大脑的另一显著特征是其缺少常人大脑中的一种皱沟。该皱沟 通常位于大脑皮层相邻的脑回之间，一般横贯顶下叶区。研究人员推测说， 缺少这一皱沟很可能会导致位于顶下叶区的神经元彼此间更容易建立起联系 ，因而使思维更为活跃。 　　威特尔森说，根据对目前她拥有的大脑标本的分析，爱因斯坦大脑的这 些特点是惟一的。根据这一发现，威特尔森假设，如果利用图像分析手段发 现某位婴儿具有爱因斯坦大脑的这些特点，那么他很可能具有超常的智力， 因此她下一步的工作就是发现这样的婴儿，并跟踪他将来是否具有这种能力 ，如果这一假设得到证实，那么爱因斯坦超常的智力之谜将会初步解开，这 有助于研究人类智能的机理，并将对人工智能技术的发展起到指导作用。 　　威特尔森收集的约150个大脑标本均来自志愿者，威特尔森对他们生前 的智力和行为进行了详尽研究，并对他们进行了累计长达30小时的测试，包 括智力、记忆力、乐感三大方面，测试内容包括阅读、数学、语言、空间想 象能力等。 　　这些志愿者去世后，威特尔森对他们的大脑进行分析，并将解剖数据与 志愿者生前不同的能力水平进行对比，结果她发现不同的才能与大脑的不同 结构有某种联系。比如，有的音乐家对音准把握得特别精确，而有的音乐家 和普通人则不具备这种能力。研究发现，前者大脑中有一种特殊结构，而后 者则没有。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 15:01:26 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA04708 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 17:01:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 17774 invoked by uid 108); 6 Apr 2000 22:00:06 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 11750 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2000 18:13:05 -0000 Received: from law-f191.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.130.101) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 4 Apr 2000 18:13:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 58497 invoked by uid 0); 4 Apr 2000 18:13:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20000404181302.58496.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.84.137.98 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 11:13:02 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.84.137.98] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 半月谈 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 18:13:02 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 31 - http://www.xys.org >哈哈，看到一位同我一样“雌雄不辩”的，闹笑话的 >原不止我啊。差点就要冲着应帆大姐前大姐后了。 分特分特！ 不仅成女的了，还成大姐了，这以后媳妇还怎么找，日子还怎么过啊？:) 各位赶快帮帮忙，消除消除影响。：) >应帆这篇文章是不是也为了验明正身而写：）？ 那倒也没有。其实我一再在文章里提到自己的性别， 不过人微言轻，大家没太介意罢了。:) 胡乱写了一个主页放在新语丝上，目前还只能用 NETSCAPE来看(IE尽看到乱码，国内的要用代理访 问)，还有几张用来验明正身的照片。欢迎提意见！：) http://www.xys.org/~ying/ 应帆 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 6 19:05:47 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA05720 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:05:47 -0500 Received: (qmail 9965 invoked by uid 108); 7 Apr 2000 02:04:17 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12827 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2000 02:03:17 -0000 Received: from mail.ttlc.net (208.130.9.4) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2000 02:03:17 -0000 Received: from msp [206.151.172.27] by mail.ttlc.net (SMTPD32-6.00) id A29F5330074; Thu, 06 Apr 2000 22:06:23 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000406220552.007de490@mail.ttlc.net> X-Sender: yige@mail.ttlc.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 22:05:52 -0700 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: yige Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 老牛 In-Reply-To: <0FSK00B8ILK67T@email.cta.cq.cn> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 32 - http://www.xys.org >这“美国美人”（一华另有一译似叫“玫瑰畸情”）我还没看， >想来和“英国病人”差不多，说它好的好的不得了，说它差的 >能在电影院里酣然入睡，醒来后勃然大怒。 其实一华的译名只要稍微改动一下，将“玫瑰畸情”改成 “美玫畸情”，就全了；即有美国，又有玫瑰，更有不三 不四的畸情遐想，比那什么“美国丽人”强多了。但是这 样的译法带有严重的资产阶级情调，所以对俺们广大贫下 中农来说，还不如翻成“老牛思嫩草”来得通俗易懂：－） ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 07:16:44 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA08012 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 09:16:44 -0500 Received: (qmail 10750 invoked by uid 108); 7 Apr 2000 14:15:24 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12992 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2000 14:18:05 -0000 Received: from mail1-px.online.sh.cn (HELO public.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.68) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2000 14:18:05 -0000 Received: from surf ([202.109.92.112]) by public.online.sh.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSN00GFI6HV2R@public.online.sh.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 18:29:56 +0800 (CST) Date: Fri, 07 Apr 2000 18:28:12 +0800 From: =?gb2312?B?z+jT7g==?= Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?udjT2srAvM3K79Sz?= To: =?gb2312?B?0MLT78u/1q7T0Q==?= Message-id: <000a01bfa07b$faa54560$de64a8c0@surf> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 Content-type: MULTIPART/ALTERNATIVE; BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_KU8btIhbx5pnmf0J1HBPZg)" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Priority: 3 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 33 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_KU8btIhbx5pnmf0J1HBPZg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: base64 - http://www.xys.org t73W29fTo7oNCiAgIMewvLjM7LGo1r3Jz7rN0evK07GotcDQwtTayb3O97eiz9bKwLzNyu/Us7XE u6/Kr6OsDQrS1LTL1qTD99bQufrKx8jLwOC1xMbw1LS12KGjvt3LtdTa06K5+qG219TIu6G31NPW vsnPDQrS0beise3By9bQw8DXqLzStcTC287EoaMNCiAgINXmysfV4tH5wvCjvw0KICAgt73W29fT xNy96cnc0rvPwtXit73D5rXExNrI3cLwo78NCg0Kz+jT7g0K ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! 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PCFET0NUWVBFIEhUTUwgUFVCTElDICItLy9XM0MvL0RURCBIVE1MIDQuMCBUcmFuc2l0aW9uYWwv L0VOIj4NCjxIVE1MPjxIRUFEPg0KPE1FVEEgY29udGVudD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PWdi MjMxMiIgaHR0cC1lcXVpdj1Db250ZW50LVR5cGU+DQo8TUVUQSBjb250ZW50PSJNU0hUTUwgNS4w MC4yMDE0LjIxMCIgbmFtZT1HRU5FUkFUT1I+DQo8U1RZTEU+PC9TVFlMRT4NCjwvSEVBRD4NCjxC T0RZIGJnQ29sb3I9I2Q4ZDBjOD4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0yPg0KPERJVj48Rk9OVCBzaXpl PTI+DQo8RElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj63vdbb19OjujwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQg c2l6ZT0yPiZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyDHsLy4zOyxqNa9yc+6zdHrytOxqLXA0MLU2sm9zve3os/WysC8 zcrv1LO1xLuvyq+jrDwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0yPtLUtMvWpMP31tC5 +srHyMvA4LXExvDUtLXYoaO+3cu11NrTorn6obbX1Mi7obfU09a+yc88L0ZPTlQ+PC9ESVY+DQo8 RElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj7S0beise3By9bQw8DXqLzStcTC287EoaM8L0ZPTlQ+PC9ESVY+DQo8 RElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj4mbmJzcDsmbmJzcDsg1ebKx9Xi0fnC8KO/PC9GT05UPjwvRElWPg0K PERJVj48Rk9OVCBzaXplPTI+Jm5ic3A7Jm5ic3A7ILe91tvX08TcvenJ3NK7z8LV4re9w+a1xMTa yN3C8KO/PC9GT05UPjwvRElWPg0KPERJVj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+z+jT7jwvRElWPjwv Rk9OVD48L0RJVj48L0ZPTlQ+PC9ESVY+PC9CT0RZPjwvSFRNTD4NCg==

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--Boundary_(ID_KU8btIhbx5pnmf0J1HBPZg)-- From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 08:01:51 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA08296 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 10:01:50 -0500 Received: (qmail 10291 invoked by uid 108); 7 Apr 2000 15:00:23 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 1867 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2000 14:59:26 -0000 Received: from imfep01.kcom.ne.jp (210.174.120.145) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2000 14:59:26 -0000 Received: from myhost ([210.230.105.32]) by imfep01.kcom.ne.jp (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000407145827.DSAB25831.imfep01.kcom.ne.jp@myhost> for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 23:58:27 +0900 Message-ID: <005d01bfa0a1$a94f7980$2069e6d2@myhost> From: "zhouping" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?IFJlOiBbeHlzIGZyaWVuZHNds8HJ+sH5vMejraOtv7S1+rzHxd4=?= Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 23:57:57 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3612.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 34 - http://www.xys.org 日本的许多节日，多少和中国有关。比如三月三，五月五。 七月七。 三月三，在日本是女儿节。五月五呢，除了长崎划龙船以 外，却是男儿节,　各家按照自家男儿的数字，在家门前 高挂几条巨大鲜艳的布制鲤鱼，取的是登龙门之意。七月 七是名符其实的七夕。说法也是牛郎织女的变种。 驱鬼节是二月三日，叫做“节分”，我不晓得这个节日是 不是来自中国或者印度。哪位知道印度是不是有这么个节 日？ 驱鬼节里，街道里要炒一大桶黄豆。到各家帮着驱鬼，并 且要高呼咒语。当然是：“鬼外边！福里边！（oni wa～ soto, fuku wa～uchi）”。不过我想这咒语翻译成：“魔 鬼外边去！财神家里来！”可能更合适些。 乐平 > - http://www.xys.org > >这大概是周作人写的日本人驱鬼的咒语。 >用什么豆子？绿豆还是炒焦的黄豆吧。 > >----- Original Message ----- >From: tanglang >To: Friends of Xin Yu Si >Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 2:08 AM >Subject: Re: [xys friends]沉生六记－－看碟记呸 > > >- http://www.xys.org > >在 00-4-5 23:55:00 Yu_He_Zhi写道： >> >> “撒豆驱鬼法”，看来只有试一下这个了： >> >> “福里边！鬼外边！” > >撒豆驱鬼真的是这样的吗？是不是咒语有误？：） > > ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 10:22:52 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA09056 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 12:22:52 -0500 Received: (qmail 20670 invoked by uid 108); 7 Apr 2000 17:21:25 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26754 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2000 17:19:47 -0000 Received: from mail1-px.online.sh.cn (HELO public.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.68) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2000 17:19:47 -0000 Received: from default ([202.109.58.125]) by public.online.sh.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSN00L0CN7OY8@public.online.sh.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Sat, 8 Apr 2000 00:31:02 +0800 (CST) Date: Sat, 08 Apr 2000 00:30:17 +0800 From: Zhou Yihua Subject: Re: [xys_friends] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A=5F=5Bxys=5Ffriends=5D=5F=CE=DE=D6=D0=C9=FA=D3?= To: "xys_friends@listbot.com" Message-id: <0FSN00L0GN7PY8@public.online.sh.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [en] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 35 - http://www.xys.org At 00-4-6 14:24:00, you wrote: >> F在ABCD内。 >> >> 一华 > >Are you sure? > >－－万精油－－ > 不好意思，真好说反了。 如果EC的延长线与AD的中垂线相交于G，则F在G的上面， 因此三角形CEF与CDF以CF为轴对称。 一华 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 13:37:12 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA09994 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 15:37:11 -0500 Received: (qmail 26847 invoked by uid 108); 7 Apr 2000 20:35:40 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 25743 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2000 20:34:56 -0000 Received: from nmr.chem.ohiou.edu (132.235.71.172) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2000 20:34:56 -0000 Received: from localhost (leo@localhost) by nmr.chem.ohiou.edu (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via ESMTP id QAA28394 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 16:27:55 -0400 Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 16:27:54 -0400 From: Jianhua Liu To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re=3A=5F=5Bxys=5Ffriends=5D=5F=CE=DE=D6=D0=C9=FA=D3?= In-Reply-To: <0FSN00L0GN7PY8@public.online.sh.cn> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 36 - http://www.xys.org Here is one for 3rd to 4th graders. I am sure many people saw it from the same source I did years ago: A = B AA = AB AA-BB = AB - BB (A+B)(A-B) = B(A-B) A+B=B 2B=B 2=1 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 19:46:26 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11260 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 21:46:26 -0500 Received: (qmail 19709 invoked by uid 108); 8 Apr 2000 02:44:58 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 13761 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2000 02:44:08 -0000 Received: from web213.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.113) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 8 Apr 2000 02:44:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 9227 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Apr 2000 02:43:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20000408024309.9226.qmail@web213.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.1.112] by web213.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 07 Apr 2000 19:43:09 PDT Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 19:43:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于世纪曙猿 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 37 - http://www.xys.org --- 翔宇 wrote: > 前几天报纸上和央视报道新在山西发现世纪曙猿的化石， >以此证明中国是人类的起源地。据说在英国《自然》杂志上 >已发表了中美专家的论文。 > 真是这样吗？ > 方舟子能介绍一下这方面的内容吗？ 你发的信有乱码，注意用纯文本发信，或在最开头加 一句英文，如Hello。 曙猿问题，我以前已“立此存照”了。下面是我为《中华 读书报》写的一篇短评。 人类的远祖起源于中国吗？ ·方舟子· 人类的故乡在哪里？这是一个在国际学术界早已解决的问题。通过比较 人和黑猩猩的DNA序列，我们知道人类的远祖在5到7百万年前与猿类分手， 形成了新的一科：人科。目前已发现的人科化石，包括南方古猿的几种、能 人、直立人、智人等，其中最早、最原始的南方古猿和能人，都只在非洲发 现。近年来发现的最早的人科化石，南方猿湖畔种和地面猿始祖种，约生活 于四百多万年前，已非常接近根据分子遗传学推算的人与猿分离的时间，而它 们也都是在非洲出土的。因此，非洲，特别是东非，是人类的故乡，已成为 国际学术界的共识。分子遗传学的多项研究结果也与这种看法一致。 一般认为，只有人科化石才能称为人类远祖。因此，见到国内报刊最近 纷纷报道“人类远祖起源于中国”，宣布“科学新发现有力地推翻了‘人类 起源于非洲’的说法”时，我还以为在中国挖掘出了最早的人科化石。细读 之下，才发现新发现的这种曙猿化石并非人科化石，不是单独属于人类的 祖先，而是高级灵长类的共同祖先，所以也可以说它是猿类的远祖、猴类 的远祖。可以说“猴类、猿类和人类的共同祖先起源于中国”，却不能单单 说“人类的远祖起源于中国“，否则我们是不是也要把原始灵长类、哺乳类、 爬行类、两栖类、鱼类、脊椎动物、动物乃至最早的细胞都称为人类的远祖？ 毕竟，追根溯源，人类就是这么一步步进化来的嘛。去年也的确有人这么干 过，在云南发现斑鳞鱼化石时，也被记者耸人听闻地报道为“在中国发现人 类的共同祖先”。 中国的确一度被视为人类的故乡。达尔文曾非常准确地预测非洲是人类 的故乡，但他的追随者、德国动物学家海格尔却认为亚洲才是。当二十年代 “北京人”出土时，就被认为在中国找到了人类的远祖。但是后来“北京人” 不再被当成半猿半人的猿人。他虽然还具有某些猿的特征，却已是相当完善 的人，因此被归为直立人。就连“北京人”是否是现代中国人的祖先，也很 成问题。按照现在获得分子遗传学支持的单一起源学说，世界各地的直立 人后来都灭绝了，所有的现代人都是大约二十万年前生活于非洲的一个人群 的后代。七十年代在云南禄丰发现的拉玛古猿，也一度被认为是人类的远祖。 分子遗传学的结果对此提出质疑，经过剧烈的辩论后，现在拉玛古猿已被公 认为猩猩的远祖。 中国两度被认为是人类的故乡，又两度被剥夺，对某些中国人来说，也 许是一件很伤面子的事。但是，如果想要恢复中国做为人类故乡的地位，就 应该老老实实地去寻找可以跟南方古猿竞争的早期人科化石，尽管这样的希 望十分渺茫。如果只是玩文字游戏，乱攀“人类远祖”，既无聊，又误导了 一般公众。而且这种“嘴瘾”，也只能在中国人自己内部过过，绝不会获得 国际的承认。鉴定曙猿的论文在国际学术刊物《自然》杂志上发表时，里面 就找不到“人类远祖在中国”之类的字眼。 2000.4.5 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 7 19:56:17 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11320 for ; Fri, 7 Apr 2000 21:56:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 416 invoked by uid 108); 8 Apr 2000 02:54:49 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4868 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2000 02:57:40 -0000 Received: from web214.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.114) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 8 Apr 2000 02:57:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 14531 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Apr 2000 02:52:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20000408025252.14530.qmail@web214.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.1.112] by web214.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 07 Apr 2000 19:52:52 PDT Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 19:52:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] Fwd: Music Question To: xys_friends@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 38 - http://www.xys.org --- Benjamin Rand wrote: > Date: Fri, 7 Apr 2000 09:01:15 -0700 (PDT) > From: Benjamin Rand > Subject: Music Question > To: smfang@yahoo.com > > Hello, > I am a student at Columbia University in New York, > USA > and am trying to do research on the popularity of > western Classical music in China. Do you have any > information to how popular classical music is in > Mainland China? How many instruments are sold a > year? > How many music schools are there in china? Do > children > learn how to play music in school and at what age? > How > many records or cd's are sold in classical music? > sheet music, tickets to concerts? Any information > you > could give me would be very, very helpful. > > Thank you very much for your assistance, > Mr. Benjamin Rand > Columbia University > > ===== > benjamin_rand@yahoo.com > Work - 212-541-0960 > Efax - 954-827-6340 > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 8 10:40:22 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA13449 for ; Sat, 8 Apr 2000 12:40:21 -0500 Received: (qmail 8294 invoked by uid 108); 8 Apr 2000 17:39:06 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26607 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2000 17:37:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.112) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 8 Apr 2000 17:37:15 -0000 Received: from jshaw ([61.128.148.216]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSP00DPBHZXSQ@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 00:33:36 +0800 (CST) Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 00:50:20 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B9=D8=D3=DA=CA=C0=BC=CD=CA=EF=D4=B3?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSP00DPCHZXSQ@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 39 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-7 19:43:00 Shi-min Fang写道： > > >你发的信有乱码，注意用纯文本发信，或在最开头加 >一句英文，如Hello。 之友网乱码信最近有点多，能避免最好，避免不了可也得 看，以免漏了什么。 有个办法：就是把原信件转存成压缩文件，再用WINZIP解 压缩，大部分乱码信件就可以看了。 具体操作如下：直接在收信软件上将该乱码信件存为XX.uue （XX随便乱起个文件名，UUE是文件后缀），如果机器上 已装了WINZIP，找到这个文件，直接一点就行了。这时 WINZIP里会出现两个文件，一个是0001.txt（信的路径）， 一个是xys_friends（信的内容），再点一下这后一个， 信的内容就出现了，没有乱码。 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 8 21:49:04 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA15749 for ; Sat, 8 Apr 2000 23:49:03 -0500 Received: (qmail 8559 invoked by uid 108); 9 Apr 2000 04:47:31 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18788 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2000 04:46:48 -0000 Received: from web3902.mail.yahoo.com (204.71.203.198) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 9 Apr 2000 04:46:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20000409044548.20055.qmail@web3902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.111.146.45] by web3902.mail.yahoo.com; Sun, 09 Apr 2000 12:45:48 CST Date: Sun, 9 Apr 2000 12:45:48 +0800 (CST) From: =?gb2312?q?=D1=EE=20=B5=C2=EE=C8?= Subject: [xys_friends] 简评周国平 To: xys_friends@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 40 - http://www.xys.org 简评周国平 近日，一品味不俗的朋友荐一本《周国平散文》给我，看了几篇，甚无趣味，感叹周国平这等低劣水平何以能让我的朋友痴迷如斯？ 不满之处，以下论之。 一、 周的文章，用典太多，自己的少。写来写去，无非证明了自己看了几本书，而这几本书，反来复去也无非是叔本华、尼采之流。 二、 重复多。看了几篇，多有重复：一是男人眼中的女人，二是女人与哲学，然后是调侃婚姻。其用典大致是①萧伯纳的关于婚姻“太太未死，谁能对此说老实话？”②孔子说“唯女子与小人难养也，近之则不孙，远之则怨”，… …云云，一个典在几篇里出现。江郎无才不足怪，何必现眼？令人生厌。 三、 长而无当，空话连篇。但举他的“幸福悖论”而言，说到底，仍不知所云。（孤以为，幸福无定式，不能一言以蔽之给其定义。幸福是一种满足的感觉，可以一时一会，也可以一生一世。不同的人，不同的环境，是不可能用一个模子来套的。例如受虐狂者，被别人毒打一顿后的感觉，可能就如常人谋得了一样觊觎已久的东西同样。 四、 妄加感言，言之无物。读他的读书感言，读来读去，等于没读。 五、 没有幽默感。 呜呼，再看一篇我就要神经错乱。 公羊 _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 登录免费电邮帐号 Get your free @yahoo.com.CN address at http://mail.yahoo.com.cn ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 8 22:03:14 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA15860 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 00:03:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 25711 invoked by uid 108); 9 Apr 2000 05:01:44 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 25603 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2000 05:00:05 -0000 Received: from mail2.connection.com (204.138.111.33) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 9 Apr 2000 05:00:05 -0000 Received: from chpshi (pm3-213.connection.com [216.13.21.213]) by mail2.connection.com (8.10.0.Beta6/8.10.0.Beta6) with SMTP id e394wgZ93485 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 00:58:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001d01bfa1e0$2543a680$d5150dd8@chpshi> From: "Shi Chuanping" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <3.0.6.32.20000406010620.007eebc0@mail.funtv.com> <000b01bf9fc7$e00b2bc0$22d16aca@xiaolan> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?UmU6IFt4eXNfZnJpZW5kc10gzt7W0Mn609A=?= Date: Sun, 9 Apr 2000 00:57:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.3825.400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.3825.400 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 41 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 - http://www.xys.org 1eLKx7j2zrG+2NDOo6zW0Lzk09C49ra0oaO63Mjd0te/tLP2wLSjusTjv7TEx7j2yP29x9DOo6jW sb3Hsd/OqjO6zTijqbrNy8Sx39DOo6jI/bj21rG9xw0Ksd+31rHwzqo1o6w1o6wzo6zB7dK7uPbQ sbHfsru53Mv8o6nE3LK7xNzX6bPJ0ru49tDCtcTI/b3H0M6jv9Tay8Sx39DOyc/H0LP20ru49sj9 vcfQzsC0o6wNCsG9uPbWsb3Hsd+1xLHIyscoNS0zKS81PTIvNSwgtvjEx7j2yP29x9DOtcTBvbj2 1rG9x7HftcSxyMrHMy84o6zGtLP2wLS1xNDCobDI/b3H0M6hsdbQvOQNCsrHsLzPwsiltcShow0K DQpQbGVhc2UgdmlzaXQgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5zdG9uaXguY29tDQpHZXQgeW91ciBmcmVlIGVtYWls IGF0IGh0dHA6Ly9zdG9uaXguenpuLmNvbQ0KICAtLS0tLSBPcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlIC0tLS0t IA0KICBGcm9tOiBZdV9IZV9aaGkgDQogIFRvOiBGcmllbmRzIG9mIFhpbiBZdSBTaSANCiAgU2Vu dDogVGh1cnNkYXksIEFwcmlsIDA2LCAyMDAwIDg6NTQgQU0NCiAgU3ViamVjdDogW3h5c19mcmll bmRzXSDO3tbQyfrT0A0KDQoNCiAgLSBodHRwOi8vd3d3Lnh5cy5vcmcgDQoNCiAgICAgIKG2v8bR p6G31NPWvsrHztLJz9GnyrHX7rCuv7S1xNTT1r7WrtK7o6zBvbj21MLHsMilyum16r+0tb3Ex8nP w+a1xM7E1cK31sDgveG8r7P2sObBy6Os09rKx77NwvLBy9K71tahtsr90afTzs+3obejqMG9suGj qaOs1/fOqs7nvOTQ3c+itcS2wc7vo6y94bn7v7TBy9K7xqq+zb+o16HBy6OsyunJz9Kyw7vT0MP3 yr7Urc6vo6zWsbW9vfHM7MnPzufT0Lj2zazKwr+0uvOjrLLFtcDGxrXEoaPO0s/ru7nT0LXj0uLL vKOszPmz9sC0x8bHxqGjo62jrcr90ae437LFsrvSqtCmo6zG5Mv7ysLPyLK71qq1wLXEv8nS1Nf3 zqrE1L3uvLHXqs3koaMNCiAgICAgIM28yajD6LXDsru6w6OstNW6z7+0sNWhow0KICAgIA0KICAg ICAgyOe4vc28y/nKvqOs0ru49tX9t73Qzsjny/nKvrfWuO6jrNTZ1+mzydK7uPa+2NDOo6zV4rj2 vtjQzrXEw+a7/dT2tPPBy9K7uPa1pc67oaMNCg0KICAgIA0KICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICDi17rJ1qUNCg0KLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tDQogIFRvIHVuc3Vic2NyaWJlLCB3cml0ZSB0byB4eXNfZnJpZW5kcy11bnN1YnNjcmliZUBs aXN0Ym90LmNvbQ0KICBTdGFydCBZb3VyIE93biBGUkVFIEVtYWlsIExpc3QgYXQgaHR0cDovL3d3 dy5saXN0Ym90LmNvbS9saW5rcy9qb2lubGINCg0K ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 - http://www.xys.org

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AooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKAC iiigAooooAKKKKACiiigAooooAKKKKAP/9k= ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA1BE.9D91CEE0-- From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 9 07:17:03 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA17430 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 09:17:02 -0500 Received: (qmail 12554 invoked by uid 108); 9 Apr 2000 14:15:29 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 3438 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2000 14:14:14 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 9 Apr 2000 14:14:14 -0000 Received: from default (putc3218143.cts.com [209.68.218.143]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA47459 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 07:13:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000409070944.007eecb0@mail.funtv.com> X-Sender: sfang@mail.funtv.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 07:09:44 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 人之异于禽兽 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 42 - http://www.xys.org 人之异于禽兽 ·方舟子· 人类很早就已意识到，人是动物，但是人是一种什么样的动物呢？我们 有什么本质特征有别于其他的动物？以前人们普遍认为，人是唯一的智能动 物，表现在能推理，能制造和使用工具，有自我意识，能够设身处地地理解 别人的想法（所谓“移情”），能用语言交流，有感情。但是我们通过研究 类人猿，发现所有这些特征都不同程度地在它们之中存在着。 早在二十世纪初，科学家们就已经发现家养的黑猩猩至少有简单的推理 能力。它们能把几个箱子垒起来，把几根棍子连成一跟长杆，然后爬到箱子 上用杆子勾挂在天花板上的水果。但是直到六十年代，珍·古德尔（Jane Goodall）才首次在野外观察到黑猩猩不仅能够使用，而且能够制造工具。 在她开始在坦桑尼亚的冈比保护区观察黑猩猩不久，就见到一头取名灰胡子 大卫（David Greybeard）的黑猩猩摘取一片草叶，仔细加工得又滑又直， 将之伸进它已用指甲挖了一个小洞的白蚁巢中钓白蚁吃。这个发现哄动一 时。古德尔的导师路易斯·利基评论说：“我们现在必须重新定义工具，重 新定义人，或者接纳黑猩猩为人类。”以后的观察发现，工具的制造和使用 在黑猩猩以及其他猿类中是一个普遍的现象。黑猩猩不仅用草叶，也用树枝 钓白蚁，每次都选择大小合适的工具，将之弄得笔直，除去树叶或旁枝，使 它变成一个完美的工具。黑猩猩也用大树枝砸碎蜂窝，或试探动物窝巢。它 们也能巧妙地使用树叶。如果它们感到饥渴，而积水在小窟隆中无法直接用 嘴饮用，它们就将树叶嚼烂成一团，将它当做海绵去吸水喝。它们也将树叶 当成餐巾纸擦掉沾到身上的果汁或泥土，或者用树叶敷伤口止血。不同的黑 猩猩群体对工具的使用存在着差异，表明这不是遗传的，而是文化的进化。 比如在西非的黑猩猩能够用石头和树枝做为锤子和砧板敲破硬果取种子吃， 而东非的黑猩猩却从来没想到这么干，尽管那里也有很多硬果。 从六十年代起，生物学家做了一系列实验，看看动物是否有自我意识， 会不会知道镜子中的就是自己。他们在麻醉的状态下在动物的眉嵴上涂上一 道无味的红颜料，如果不照镜子是看不到这道红色的。结果，黑猩猩和猩猩 会从镜子中发现自己头上有这道红色，并用手指去碰它，再把手指拿到鼻子 好奇地闻一闻。有的黑猩猩还能借助镜子剃牙，甚至好奇地探寻它平时 看不到的身体部位（比如阴部）。其它的动物包括猴子都没有这个本事。猴 子显然知道镜子是怎么回事，如果它从镜子中看到有人出现在镜子中，会马 上转身看看，但是它就是不知道自己的影子是属于谁的。 那么黑猩猩是否能够意识到其他意识的存在？能否设身处地地猜测其 他个体的想法，也就是有移情能力？我们人类在三岁以后才有这种能力。心 理学家们为不同年龄的小孩上演一出简单的木偶戏：莎莉将球放进一个篮子 中盖上盖子，然后离开舞台。安妮趁莎莉不在时将球拿出来放进盒子中藏好， 并将篮子盖重新盖上。莎莉回到舞台后，实验者问小孩：“莎莉将会在哪里 找球？”三岁的小孩都回答说：“盒子！”他们知道球在盒子中，以为莎莉 也会知道。只有四岁的小孩才会移情到莎莉心中为她设想，回答说：“篮子！” 对黑猩猩，我们没法这么询问，只能设计间接的实验研究。其中一个实验是 这样做的。让一头黑猩猩知道在两个箱子中有不同的东西：一个装着食物， 一个装着蛇。然后让它和其他黑猩猩一起进来。它将其他黑猩猩带到装蛇的 箱子前，把其他黑猩猩全吓跑了以后，自己到另一个箱子取出食物单独食用。 因此，看来黑猩猩能够进行欺诈，能够预测别的个体的反应并从中获利。 这种移情能力不仅使黑猩猩能够有意识地欺诈利己，也能有意识地冒险 利他。古德尔观察到这样一件事。雌猩猩颇姆（Pom）和她的小弟弟普洛夫 （Prof）一前一后在森林中走，颇姆看到前面的路上有一条大蛇，发出了警 告逃到树上。但普洛夫没看到蛇，继续向前走去。于是颇姆从树上跑下来， 满脸惊慌地抱起普洛夫一起跑掉了。1996年8月，在芝加哥附近的布鲁克菲 尔德动物园（Brookfield）发生了一件更令人惊叹的事。一名三岁的小男孩 掉进了大猩猩的笼子中失去了知觉。一头雌大猩猩宾提爪娃（Binti Jua） 在游客们的恐叫声中迅速过去抱起这位小男孩，赶走了另一头逼近的大猩猩， 走到边角，温柔地将小男孩放在笼门的后面，在那里小男孩被救出治疗，很 快康复。一名游客用录象摄影机拍下了整个过程。 跟人类一样，猿类同样有感情。当第一只学会用美国手语与人交谈的黑 猩猩瓦苏（Washoe）的婴儿夭折时，她悲痛欲绝，使得研究人员非常担心她 会伤心而死。古德尔在野外就观察到，在一头叫弗洛（Flo）的雌黑猩猩死 亡后，她的儿子弗林特（Flint）因伤心过渡而死亡。研究人员还观察到， 在一次战斗中一只黑猩猩阵亡，同一群体的黑猩猩举行一种仪式，聚在一 起挨个慰问死者的兄弟。这也可以说是宗教的雏型。 猿类经过训练后，有着更令人赞叹的智能。日本一头叫做爱（Ai）的雌 黑猩猩不仅能够认识从0到9的数字，还学会将数字从小到大排列。研究表明， 她看一眼能够记住五个数字的序列，识数能力相当于学龄前的儿童（成年人 平均一眼能记住七个数字）。爱还能理解简单的手语和日语会话，但是跟别 的黑猩猩相比，她的语言能力并不突出。由于猿类的发音器官限制了它们能 象人一样讲话，只能采用别的辅助办法。从六十年代起，美国研究人员已开 始教黑猩猩、大猩猩美国手语，并取得了很大的成功。最成功者能掌握几百 个手语词汇，用于与人类交谈、猿之间相互交谈或自言自语。以后研究人员 又开始采用计算机技术，让黑猩猩按贴着符号的键盘交流。其中最成功的是 矮小种黑猩猩莰兹（Kanzi）和他的妹妹潘班尼莎（Panbanisha）。莰兹出 生于1981年，在研究人员试图教他的母亲玛塔塔（Matata）用计算机键盘交 谈时，他自己看着学会了，玛塔塔则一直没学会交谈（可能是因为开始学的 时候年纪已太大）。而且，出乎研究人员意料的是，莰兹还自然而然地听懂 了英语，能够听懂很复杂的新句子，比如“到办公室去把红色球拿过来”。 以后研究人员就用类似教小孩说话的方式教莰兹交谈。1999年，莰兹和潘班尼 莎都装备了手提电脑，并用语音合成技术将它们输入的句子朗读出来，真正 可以跟人用声音对话了。它们能够使用约250个词汇，并能听明白两到三千个 英语词汇。在它们学会使用的词汇中，有很具体的单词（比如“香蕉”、 “苹果”），也有很抽象的单词（比如“它”、“是”、“好”、“要”）， 并能用这些单词组成简单的句子，自己发出“我写，给葡萄”、“球去小组 房”（要玩在小组房看到的球）之类的要求。他能够回答昨天都干了什么， 明天想要干什么等等。研究者认为他有四岁小孩的思维和语言能力。玛塔塔不 会交谈，就把她的要求告诉潘班尼莎，潘班尼莎再把玛塔塔的要求说出来，比 如“玛塔塔要一根香蕉。”潘班尼莎并开始用粉笔在地板上写字，很显然是想 学会写出现在计算机屏幕上的字母。 一头叫阐特克（Chantek）的猩猩也表现出了高超的智能。在学了二十年 之后，他已掌握了两千多个美国手语词汇。在装备了语音合成器之后，他也很 快学会了用计算机说话，说出的第一句话是：“请给我买一个汉堡包。”研究 者在他完成某项工作（比如清理自己的房间）后，给他的奖励不是食物，而是 钱，然后他再用钱买自己要的东西。阐特克不仅学会了使用钱，而且知道制造 假币。起初研究者用扑克筹码做钱，他就把筹码掰成两半当两个钱花。后来研 究者改用金属圈当钱，他找到了一些铝箔，用它伪造金属圈想当钱使。现在研 究者支付他硬币。研究者也试图教他一些道德观念，象储蓄、分享或慈善行为。 但看来很不容易。研究者给他一把葡萄，告诉他两个分享，但他在把葡萄吃光 后，才似乎想起要分享，把葡萄枝给了研究者。现在阐特克正在把赚到的钱存 起来，用手语告诉研究者：“我要买一个水池。”显然是因为他所在的亚特兰 大动物园气候太热了。 所有这一切，都表明猿有着复杂的心灵。我们早就知道人和黑猩猩在遗传 上极为接近，有99％以上的蛋白质相同，至少98.5％的DNA相同，就象同一个属 的姐妹种。我们曾经一直奇怪为什么在遗传上如此相近的物种却有如此不同的 行为，而现在我们已经知道，即使在行为上，猿类也要比我们想象的更接近人 类。它们使我们深刻地意识到人类的起源。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com 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So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 9 19:12:57 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA19806 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 21:12:56 -0500 Received: (qmail 2524 invoked by uid 108); 10 Apr 2000 02:11:21 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18029 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2000 02:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2000 02:13:54 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.151.236]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FSS003OQ38B35@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:07:26 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:13:26 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: [xys_friends] =C8=CB=D6=AE=D2=EC=D3=DA=C7=DD=CA=DE?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FSS003OR38C35@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id VAA19806 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 43 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-9 7:09:00 Shi-min Fang写道： > - http://www.xys.org > > 人之异于禽兽 > > ·方舟子· > > 人类很早就已意识到，人是动物，但是人是一种什么样的动物呢？我们 >有什么本质特征有别于其他的动物？以前人们普遍认为，人是唯一的智能动 >物，表现在能推理，能制造和使用工具，有自我意识，能够设身处地地理解 >别人的想法（所谓“移情”），能用语言交流，有感情。但是我们通过研究 >类人猿，发现所有这些特征都不同程度地在它们之中存在着。 舟子的意思是不是这些个猿类在智能方面与我们人类只有程度上的差别，而 没有本质的区别？ 但这种程度上的差别也是巨大的。比如前几天讨论的“无中生有”，猿类肯 定不懂，当然他们也不关心；而人类只要稍加提醒（螳螂等）甚至不加提醒 （万金油等），就可以大致明了。 为什么会有这么大的差别呢。有个比较传统的解释是动物即便是猿类主要的 思维方式是具象思维（也叫形象思维），而人类的主要思维方式是抽象思维。 具象思维，也就是说在思维过程中，出现在脑海里的主要是形象，即便是有 所推理，也是具体物体的影象在脑海里折腾。而抽象思维则是把这些形象和 折腾过程符号化了。显然后者更有利于学习和记忆，速度也更为快捷。 > 猿类经过训练后，有着更令人赞叹的智能。日本一头叫做爱（Ai）的雌 >黑猩猩不仅能够认识从0到9的数字，还学会将数字从小到大排列。研究表明， >她看一眼能够记住五个数字的序列，识数能力相当于学龄前的儿童（成年人 >平均一眼能记住七个数字）。爱还能理解简单的手语和日语会话，但是跟别 我怀疑爱对于数字也是具象的，比如说她知道一个苹果，七个苹果的差别， 但未必知道1和7的差别，不是符号的形状，而是符号的抽象意义，也就是 说基本的“数学能力”。 >英语词汇。在它们学会使用的词汇中，有很具体的单词（比如“香蕉”、 具体的单词就不必说了，智力水平远低于猿类的哺乳动物经由条件反射刺 激强化，也可以掌握不少。 >“苹果”），也有很抽象的单词（比如“它”、“是”、“好”、“要”）， >并能用这些单词组成简单的句子，自己发出“我写，给葡萄”、“球去小组 抽象的单词才是关键所在。对该实验我知之不多，相信这种思维过程已有 抽象的味道，但具不具备抽象的实质？心存疑虑。 >房”（要玩在小组房看到的球）之类的要求。他能够回答昨天都干了什么， >明天想要干什么等等。研究者认为他有四岁小孩的思维和语言能力。玛塔塔不 >会交谈，就把她的要求告诉潘班尼莎，潘班尼莎再把玛塔塔的要求说出来，比 >如“玛塔塔要一根香蕉。”潘班尼莎并开始用粉笔在地板上写字，很显然是想 >学会写出现在计算机屏幕上的字母。 儿童心理学中，认为3岁半到四岁是道坎，有趣的是很多人只记得自己三 岁后的经历，但3岁的小孩则可以记得2岁时的经历（当然是深刻的经历）。 因此有人怀疑儿童三岁半时思维方式发生了重大变化，以前以具象思维为 主，之后抽象思维渐渐占据主导。抽象思维显然既节省时间也节省能源。 据说，有个叫高斯的数学家智商很高，他试着用具象的思维方式做简单数 学，比如说用不同的气味代表不同的数字。这个真是太难了！也许猿做起 来反而容易些。：） > 所有这一切，都表明猿有着复杂的心灵。我们早就知道人和黑猩猩在遗传 >上极为接近，有99％以上的蛋白质相同，至少98.5％的DNA相同，就象同一个属 >的姐妹种。我们曾经一直奇怪为什么在遗传上如此相近的物种却有如此不同的 >行为，而现在我们已经知道，即使在行为上，猿类也要比我们想象的更接近人 >类。它们使我们深刻地意识到人类的起源。 我儿子属猴，我认为在他三岁前，他就是个猴。：） 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 9 19:42:28 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA20017 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 2000 21:42:27 -0500 Received: (qmail 24223 invoked by uid 108); 10 Apr 2000 02:40:53 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 23533 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2000 02:39:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2000 02:39:04 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id KAA01198 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:38:10 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 12 Apr 1999 03:03:09 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA11327 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:35:43 +0800 Message-ID: <00a901bfa295$c320d980$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000409044548.20055.qmail@web3902.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:37:48 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 44 - http://www.xys.org > 近日，一品味不俗的朋友荐一本《周国平散文》给我，看了几篇，甚无趣味，感叹周国平 这等低劣水平何以能让我的朋友痴迷如斯？ : 他的文字只配投入焚化炉，有什么可看的？批评他都是给他面子。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! 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It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 9 22:23:41 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA20661 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 00:23:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 15851 invoked by uid 108); 10 Apr 2000 05:21:57 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4576 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2000 05:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2000 05:20:54 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id NAA01327 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 13:19:16 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 12 Apr 1999 05:44:15 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA21661 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 13:16:49 +0800 Message-ID: <013101bfa2ac$46595f00$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <0FSP00DPCHZXSQ@email.cta.cq.cn> Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 13:18:57 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 45 - http://www.xys.org 在 虚 白 中 坐 驰 《追忆似水年华》的七卷中译本刚一出齐的那年，我就把它们买 了下来。此后我一连读了数次，都没能读完它。是这本书不好吗？当 然不是。 每次只要读了一页以上，我都会不自禁地反思当时的内心是否虚 明，可每次都觉得自己不能够“虚白高人静，”就只好掩上书卷，任 “喧卑俗累牵”了。 这样的书，不是随时都可以读的。不过，以前读过的片段，有空 还是愿意再读的，尤其是对“小玛德兰点心”的那一段。我是在买到 全书的前几年在一本现代派作品选里看到它的——我想，就凭这两页 文字，普鲁斯特就当得起大师的称号了。偶尔，当我再想起此书，就 会想到这段文字，想到那个在茶点里品味人生的人。 那个人是普鲁斯特，他是懂得生活价值的人，能唤回昨天的人。 记得有那么几年，报刊上到处是些“子不语”的新闻。其中的一 则是这么说的：某地留存的一段南朝时的宫墙，每于某年某日的月夜 某时，即可见三五个南朝宫女的倩影在墙边无声地游移。借着溶溶月 色，你仿佛能感觉到她们“巧笑倩兮，美目盼兮”的笑貌——当然， 这些“幽梦影”只持续十秒钟就消失了。 这种当代传说当然是胡说，逝去的生命不能真的再现，哪怕是影 子。但回忆却可以。有些回忆就躲在我们记忆的某一个隐秘点里，只 要你恰巧在心境完全平和时看到了某种特别的介质，它们必将在我们 的眼里，心里重现，并带我们坐驰回昨天——我的这种看法该不是胡 说吧。 前几天，附近由于修路，所有的车辆都易辙而行了。改道的当日， 我站在回家的公共汽车上，望着车窗外向后移去的天空，心里什么都 没有想。 忽然，看到路上的尘土增多了，不由收低了目光往路边瞥了一眼， 发现这是一条陌生的路——不，这是一条我曾经非常熟悉的路…… 车还在往前奔驰，可我却觉得一切都停了下来，这条路上的一切 也都在眼中成为定格。 围在一起打扑克的那些老头子的手扬到半空中就止住了，聚在那 家食杂店门口谈天的老妇人们脸上的表情凝住了，三五个在那里玩的 脏孩子的脚似乎永远立在那些灰红色的平房之间，再也不能移动。 二十年了，除了那些面孔，这条路上的一切似乎丝毫没有改变。 汽车在向左转的刹那，路上的一切又动了起来。许多童年记忆的亡灵 纸钱般洒满了整个天地，无声地跳起舞来。我看见了。我看见了很多 没有瞳仁的眼睛，很多枯干瘦小的脏手，很多被灰尘裹失了颜色的玻 璃球，很多写满歪歪斜斜的铅笔字的作业本，很多若隐若现的面孔， 很多随飘风升上天空的蒲公英的小伞……这一切把天地的缝隙全部填 满，给了我一种无比压抑的沉重感，就像置身于一个最黑暗的夜。 可星星们出现了。虽然它们都稍纵即逝，但我还来得及在消失前 看见它们：学校水房里的一条小蛇，第一天上学路上拉住我的老师的 手，第一次因当上“三好学生”而得到的奖品，某个雨天在小水沟中 航行着的泛着奇妙光彩的油笔芯小船，用橡皮筋射向同学的废纸折成 的子弹，中午用二两粮票和八分钱买来的两个香喷喷的小圆面包，开 运动会时带的饭盒里装的令我想了几个月的鸡蛋炒蒜苔，偷偷砸到教 导主任光光的后脑勺上的一个大雪球，拎着一小袋大楂子攥着一毛五 分钱去嘣爆米花的那个下午，操场上乱飞一气的纸飞机，花三分钱就 可以坐在那里看一下午小人书的摊子…… 这些于转瞬间在那条尘土漫天的泥土路上复活的记忆呵。黄昏给 它们罩上朦胧的光，一张在空中彳亍着的现实里的黄纸片让它们变得 如此遥远，车窗外的那些还光秃着的树枝使它们显得有些凄凉，车里 的人声最终令它们成了叫我怀疑的回忆。 人都走光后，到了终点站的我才神思恍惚地下了车。是马路市场 里凄惨而又甜蜜的叫卖声才让我彻底回到了现实：二十年前，哪里都 没有马路市场，都没有这么多的车，也没有路边的广告牌。那时候似 乎什么都没有。 那时候只有唱片，那时的每个人都是唱片，可就是没有CD 唱机。 听着CD机里播放的Bonfiglio的那张“紫口琴”，忽然想起我也 有过一把口琴，可那是多少年前的事情了呢？高三那年吧。我记得是 用从午饭钱里省下的两元钱买的那把单音口琴。回家后便照着说明书 “吹吸”起来，不久就能弄出调来了。 学习之余，我总是爱吹口琴。吹的曲子只有简单的几首：《城南 旧事》里的“送别”，《红河谷》等。我特别喜欢吹《红河谷》，在 等待发榜的那些日子里我几乎天天吹它。有时吹累了，就只反复吹那 两句的旋律：“要记住红河谷你的故乡，还有那热恋你的姑娘”。 在我拼命地吹气吸气的时候，我才有活着的感觉，好像没有口琴 我就无法呼吸一样。那时房间里传出的声音一定很刺耳难听，但除了 我的心跳，我却什么都听不到。 等到录取通知书发下来，我才彻底的放弃了我的口琴。我把所有 的高中课本一本本的撕碎，将那些碎片与我珍爱过的口琴一起装到一 个大袋子里扔到了楼下的垃圾站。 第二天，大垃圾车就会把它们带走，投到垃圾焚化炉里。那时我 的学生时代就彻底被烧成灰烬了，我很高兴能捱到这一天。（当然， 我又学了几年财经，不过那些课我从来就没有听过，所以除了财经应 用文和英语，别的课程后来都是补了考才及格的。） 我再不想做好学生甚至学生了。我根本就不懂吹口琴也不想再吹。 但我还是爱听口琴的声音，所以才一连买了数张Bonfiglio的系列口 琴曲CD。他的CD中，我最爱的就是“紫口琴”，因为听这张CD时，也 仿佛有了普鲁斯特品尝小点心时的感觉，心中一无所牵，就像静静地 坐在松花江边，听着水流的声音的那个下午。 那是在刚毕业工作不久后的一个下午，我借故旷工半天，想一个 人在女人堆之外走走。不知怎么就来到了松花江边。 我沿着江畔一路走下去，过了九站，来到一处没有人的堤岸，坐 在离水最近的一层石阶上，望向江水里跳跃着的阳光，感觉着有一点 点腥味的秋风，吸着我淡淡的纸烟，想就这么过一个下午。 吸了两根烟后，身后走过来一个老头子。他坐下来，打开他的包， 取出一个大饭盒和三个广口罐头瓶子。那些玻璃瓶口上都缠着一圈锯 齿状的黑胶皮，一边还系着长长的细鱼线。他往透明的瓶子里塞了些 金色的大饼子，又把那三根绳子的末端固定到黄色的沙岸上，然后才 将这些瓶子远远抛入灰银色的江中。 这些上面缚着漏斗状胶皮的瓶子是用来捉鱼的吗？我看了看坐在 那里卷着纸烟的老头，感到有些奇怪。管他呢，反正与我无关，我只 想一个人歇一会儿。于是我起身要走，那时老头子却与我攀谈起来。 不久，我就知道那些瓶子真是用来捉鱼的。小鱼们闻到瓶里大饼 子的香味，就会钻进去，而进去后就很难出来了。起初我还不太相信， 直到几分钟后老头拉回瓶子为止。老头子把那胶皮撑开，将小鱼倒入 饭盒，再往瓶里装些大饼子，然后又将其抛进水里，等几分钟后就再 重复一遍这些动作。望着渐渐增多的小鱼，我不由想起王维的两句诗： “此是安口腹，非关慕隐沦。”这老头子可能也是这样吧。每新添一 种小鱼，他都要对我介绍一番：这是小白鱼，那是泥鳅，这不是鲫瓜 子是葫芦籽，看，一条蹿丁子，这是嘎牙子，哦，还有一条麦穗儿…… 后来，关于鱼没什么可说的了，因为松花江里的鱼似乎只有这么几种。 不谈鱼的时候，他就一边吸着烟，一边谈他的家，谈他自己。因此我 知道他退休前是橡胶厂的工人，那些胶皮就是证明，我还知道他喜欢 吃鱼虾，这个饭盒如果装满了回去就有鱼酱吃了，我还知道他的老伴 已死了一年了，不过他的日子也还过得去，他从小就在松花江边长大， 以前这条江是清澈见底的，里面还有乌龟呢…… 在他谈话时，我从沙子里翻出几个江蛤蜊，就把它们放到脚边， 忽而看看它们在沙上爬动的样子，忽而抬头淡然的望向远空，随口应 答着，感觉就像在梦里一样。蛤蜊在沙上爬过的痕迹一道一道的拉长， 天色一点一点的变暗，风一丝一丝的转凉，纸烟散出的烟雾一缕一缕 的变淡。不那么刺眼的阳光，静静地笼罩了一切。这些又让我想起了 王维的两句诗：“圆光含万象，碎影入闲流。”这诗本是吟咏升起的 秋阳的，可在此刻体会，感受也一样的真切。“闲流”中除了“碎影” 还多了种“碎语”，这反使诗里的意境扩得更远了。 老头子说得其实很少，而且每次谈话的间隔都很久，所以那一下 午说的话可能还不如一个女人十分钟里说的多。我除了应答，几乎什 么都没说，因为我从来就不善于也不愿意讲话。但能有人倾听，老头 子似乎就很高兴了。听到后来，我几乎听不到他在说什么了，尤其在 想起那两句诗后，我只是在想着王维，望着开始泛红的江水，吸着淡 淡的纸烟，渐渐忘掉了自我的存在。 那个大饭盒终于装满了，老头子也准备离开。临走前，他要送我 些小鱼，可是我却只留下一条最美丽的小葫芦籽。他走后，我把小鱼 轻轻地送回了水中。在它消失的刹那，我的心里无比的快乐。 我不喜欢吃鱼。我只喜欢看它们不受打扰地在水里快活地游动的 样子。不过那污浊的江水却让我无法看清它们。但我能想象得到，每 个自由的生命都该是快乐的。 生命是快乐的还是不幸的，今天我们往往并不知道。除非你是一 个局外人，或者等今天的生命过去后，你在最宁静的时刻借助某种介 质仿若不经意地追怀起它们时才可以真切的感觉得到。 那种介质可以是一条路，一张口琴曲CD，从音乐里寻回的某个下 午，或者是一口带着小玛德兰点心屑的茶： “这口带着点心屑的茶一碰到我的上颚，我便猛然一惊，注意到在 我身上发生了奇妙的事情。一种美妙的快感侵袭了我，使我超脱了周 围的一切，而我却不知道快感由何而来。它立即使我对人世的沧桑感 到淡漠，对人生的挫折泰然处之，将生命的短暂看作过眼云烟……” 普鲁斯特在不经意中寻回了被遗忘的昨天的美妙，我也如此。当 然，我还找到了点别的东西。但是，那些被遗忘了的昨天经过今天静 静的品味、琢磨，或许已经不大像原来的样子了，甚至被加工成与实 际大相径庭的东西。所以说，那些偶然间被触发出来的回忆在某种程 度上只能说是种关于过去的想象而已。但正是这些想象才使我真切的 感受到了生命，“使我超脱了周围的一切”，给了我面对这几乎让我 绝望的现实生活的勇气。 昨天还会复活，或者以新的形象再生，只要那些埋得最深的记忆 在某一时刻从我们的眼里，心里重现；普鲁斯特的逝水年华还会再返， 只要我读完《追忆逝水年华》这本书。 让我为此静静地等待下去吧。 2000．4．8夜9：25写；2000．4．9下午1：10改；2000．4．10 中午12：40录 河 流 雪落满了这个小城的四季 最高一层大厦里的那双眼 盯着窗下的最后一座楼 直到被白色的黑暗吞没 第二天春天的某日 邻城的人们悠闲地 品味着下午茶的时候 看到了报纸上的那则广告 唇边便都泛起了笑意 积雪融尽后的夏天 度假者从邻城划着小船 到这条新生的河流里销闲 阳光晴好 水面平静 尸体们鱼儿般游来游去 2000．4．9下午2：15写于大雪中 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! 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It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 10 06:43:46 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA23149 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 08:43:45 -0500 Received: (qmail 10173 invoked by uid 108); 10 Apr 2000 13:42:11 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 1497 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2000 13:41:48 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2000 13:41:48 -0000 Received: from default (putc32161209085.cts.com [216.120.9.85]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA98008 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 06:40:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000410063625.007eea80@mail.funtv.com> X-Sender: sfang@mail.funtv.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 06:36:25 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 《进化新篇章》序言 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 46 - http://www.xys.org 序言 1882年4月19日，73岁的查尔斯·罗伯特·达尔文在家中安祥地逝世。 一周后，在英国国会的要求下，达尔文被安葬在伦敦威斯特敏斯特大教堂， 他的身边安息着另一位科学巨人、物理学之父伊萨克·牛顿。 做为现代生物学之父的达尔文，身后留下了有关地质学、动物学和植 物学的大量学术著作，一部维多利亚时代最负盛名的航海游记和一本直至 本世纪五十年代才得以完整地出版的自传。其中，最著名的当然是在1859 年一出版就掀起轩然大波、引发了西方思想史上科学和宗教的最大的一次 论战、达尔文自己也称之为“一部长篇争辩”的科学进化论的开山之作 《物种起源》。达尔文的“共同祖先”学说不仅深刻地揭示了所有生物的 起源，而且牢固地确立了人类在自然界中的位置。达尔文的“自然选择” 学说则为科学方法和哲学思想提供了一个崭新的、可能是最有威力的观念。 达尔文因此领导了人类历史上最为伟大、影响最为深远的一场理性革命。 这场革命统一了生命与非生命两个世界，提供了一种全新的世界观、生命 观、宇宙观和方法论，波及了几乎所有的科学和人文领域。 在达尔文逝世近120年之后，有关进化论的争辩远未平息。一方面， 基督教的原教旨主义者信奉《旧约》的“创世记”乃是万物起源的万世不 移的真理，打着“科学神创论”的幌子，从根本上否认“生物是进化的” 这一科学事实，向公众散布了大量的谣言和谎言，宣称进化论已被最新的 科学成果所否定，在公众当中引起了很大的混乱。另一方面，在生物学界 内部，在确信“生物是进化”的这一共识之下，也对生物进化的过程和机 理进行着激烈的论战。进化生物学从未象现在这样取得如此丰盛的成果， 也从未象现在这样面临着如此众多的挑战。 这本科普著作也是一本有关进化论的争辩的书。限于编幅，我未对 “科学神创论”做太多的驳斥，只具体分析了最为常见的几个谣言，相信 不抱偏见的读者在读完这本书之后，自己也不难识破“科学神创论”的其 他谣言和谎言。本书的主要笔墨用于介绍当前生物学界对进化论的一些重 大问题，特别是自然选择、性选择、分子进化、生命起源、个体发育与大 进化、物种大灭绝、人类进化这些领域的研究、争议和思考，让读者们能 够了解一些现代进化论的新成果和新问题。进化生物学做为一门生机勃勃 的科学，本身也在不停地进化。 本书所持的观点，属于结合了分子生物学的新达尔文主义。以自然选 择原理为核心内容的新达尔文主义又称做“综合学说”，至今仍是现代进 化论的主流学说。但是，该学说形成于五十年代初，分子生物学创建的前 夕。分子生物学的发展一方面支持了新达尔文主义的主要观点，另一方面 也揭示了新达尔文主义的局限，因此必须以分子生物学的成果补充、修正 新达尔文主义。分子生物学是现代进化论的基础，而自然选择则是现代进 化论的核心机制。笔者相信，生命现象是自然选择作用下的物理、化学现 象，因此，将分子生物学与自然选择原理相结合，原则上即足以解释生物 进化乃至一切生命现象。本书的第一章先集中地阐明了这个哲学观点，以 后的各章，事实上都可看做是对这一观点的展开论述和举例说明。最后一 章对全书做了总结，并对人文问题提出了一些思考。 我对进化论情有独钟，有个人的原因。我在上小学时，读到了已故遗 传学家方宗熙公所撰写的科普著作《生命进行曲》，使我初知生命进化的 奇妙。1982年国内大张旗鼓地纪念达尔文逝世一百周年，使我首次接触到 了达尔文的著作，激起作为中学生的我对一代科学伟人的敬仰，促使我选 择生物学做为自己的专业。1993年中文互联网刚刚兴起，我当时正在美国 一所大学攻读生物化学博士学位，就利用业余时间开始在国际互联网上普 及进化论，批判神创论。1997年，香港天地图书公司出版了我写的《进化 新解说》一书，很受读者欢迎，不久即售罄。1998、1999年我回国探亲时， 发现国内出版了不少或明或暗地反进化论的书籍，而普及进化论的著作相 当少见。国内一些主要报刊，至今仍然可以见到反进化论的文章。一些自 以为是以进化论为依据的文章、著作，也有不少常识性错误。这一切，都 使我觉得有必要也在中国大陆出版普及进化论的著作。这本书，就是在 《进化新解说》的基础上修改、扩写而成，篇幅为原来的两倍多。本书所 面向的读者，是具有中、高等文化程度，特别是学过高中生物课、具有一 定的现代生物学常识的读者。对那些未学过高中生物课或虽学过而已遗忘 的读者，可参阅附录“现代生物学基本常识”补习。 本书在写作过程中，参考了英美许多进化论论文、专著，因属于科普 著作，为方便读者阅读，按惯例未在文中一一注明。附录列出了参考文献， 并重点推荐了一部分有关的优秀著作，供有志于进一步学习进化论的读者 以及对翻译进化论著作感兴趣的出版社参考。本书的个别章节曾在中国科 学院主办的《科学时报》上发表。第一章第二节“还原主义和整体主义” 改编自我撰写的一篇生物哲学论文。全书初稿曾在互联网上的“新语丝学 术论坛”和“新语丝之友”电子通信网连载，许多网友给予鼓励和提出了 宝贵意见。湖南省新闻出版局的周实先生和湖南教育出版社的符本清先生 为本书的编辑、出版提供了不少帮助。上海作家张远山先生做了一部分文 字校对。在此对这些朋友一并表示感谢。由于进化论涉及了现代生物学的 几乎所有学科，其中有些学科笔者只有肤浅的了解，若有误解或错误，欢 迎读者指正，以便在以后有机会再版时更正。 方舟子（生物化学博士） 2000年4月5日于加州圣地亚哥 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 10 17:33:19 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA26076 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 19:33:18 -0500 Received: (qmail 24392 invoked by uid 108); 11 Apr 2000 00:31:53 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 6422 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2000 00:34:38 -0000 Received: from web215.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.115) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 11 Apr 2000 00:34:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 11196 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Apr 2000 00:29:40 -0000 Message-ID: <20000411002940.11195.qmail@web215.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.9.193] by web215.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 17:29:40 PDT Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 17:29:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 人之异于禽兽 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 47 - http://www.xys.org --- tanglang wrote: >为什么会有这么大的差别呢。有个比较传统的解释是动物即便是猿类主要的 >思维方式是具象思维（也叫形象思维），而人类的主要思维方式是抽象思维。 我举的那些实验就是为了说明猿也有抽象思维。有了 抽象思维才有可能掌握语言和句法。 为了避免具象干扰，研究者给黑猩猩用的键盘符号，都 是抽象符号，跟符号代表的事务没有任何相象之处。 >我怀疑爱对于数字也是具象的，比如说她知道一个苹果，七个苹果的差别， >但未必知道1和7的差别，不是符号的形状，而是符号的抽象意义，也就是 > 说基本的“数学能力”。 实验时用的是抽象的数学符号，而不是具体的物品。 > >具体的单词就不必说了，智力水平远低于猿类的哺乳动物经由条件反射刺 > 激强化，也可以掌握不少。 > 七十年代开始做猿类语言实验时，也一直有人怀疑只是 条件反射，不过现在因为实验设计越来越精密，已很少 有人怀疑了。 我已说过，Kanzi开始学语言的时候，是自己学会的， 而不是用食物刺激的方法教会的。 而且，条件反射只能是重复已学过的东西，而无法听 懂新的句子，和自创词汇、句法。 方舟子 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 10 18:46:12 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA26797 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 20:46:12 -0500 Received: (qmail 21904 invoked by uid 108); 11 Apr 2000 01:44:47 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 10840 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2000 01:44:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 11 Apr 2000 01:44:09 -0000 Received: from p2 by mail.qdcatv.com.cn with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 13:04:13 +0800 Message-ID: <001101bfa2aa$ede96820$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <3.0.6.32.20000409070944.007eecb0@mail.funtv.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 人之异于禽兽 Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 13:09:20 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 48 - http://www.xys.org - http://www.xys.org > > 人之异于禽兽 > > ·方舟子· > > 早在二十世纪初，科学家们就已经发现家养的黑猩猩至少有简单的推理 > 能力。它们能把几个箱子垒起来，把几根棍子连成一跟长杆，然后爬到箱子 > 上用杆子勾挂在天花板上的水果。但是直到六十年代，珍·古德尔（Jane 舟子说的这个实验让我想起来一部科幻电影。好象叫什么“逃离地球”。讲的 是在未来，人类文明由于自相残杀而衰落。一群猿人崛起，统治世界，创造了 自己的文明。三个猿人科学家乘飞船穿越时空来到地球，被人类抓住。在飞船 里发现的猿自然很奇怪，于是就对他们进行研究。本来那三位猿人想隐瞒自己 具有高智能，便装得跟普通猿猴一样。到了给其中一个专攻人类行为的猿生物 学家做香蕉实验时候，那位猿小姐显然是有些忍不住了，因为这些都是她以前 研究人类的实验内容，现在却用在自己身上。所以她迅速的把箱子垒起来，走 了上去，却立刻做了下来。旁边的人很奇怪，她为什么不去拿香蕉？猿小姐突 然用很纯正的英语说：“我讨厌香蕉”。：） 有些动物的确很聪明。我看到过有本书上说，人的智商是210，其次是海豚为 190，大象为150，猴子为63。我对于这个结果是有些疑问的。一来科学家做研 究的时候难免是要掺进一点主观色彩的，总有种先入为主的观念认为人比其他 动物都聪明。二来人类对于思维模式的了解也有限，因此制订智商的标准就难 免有失偏颇。至少，人类对于其他动物的思维不那么了解，特别是像海豚这样 跟我们有很大差异的海洋哺乳动物。人们根据自己有具象思维和抽象思维，就 把这套标准套到海豚身上，是不那么公平的，至少是不利于海豚的。说不定海 豚还有其他的思维模式而我们根本就不知道。假如有个海豚科学家也做这类实 验，制订了一个他自以为很公正的智商标准，搞不好结果要倒过来，海豚是210， 而人类是190。 海豚的确是一种聪明的动物，至少是跟人类差不多聪明。黑猩猩需要训练几十 次才能学会的本领，海豚只要学几次就掌握了。美国佛罗里达州有个海豚研究 中心，用海豚辅导治愈智能障碍儿童。越战的时候，美军专门训练了6只海豚来 对付越南的“蛙人”。海湾战争的时候，又利用海豚找水雷。海豚还可以帮人 测量人不易达到的海域的海洋学资料，帮助渔民管理渔群等等。 我觉得对于像海豚、大象、黑猩猩这些高智商动物，把他们关到动物园供人观 赏，用他们来做实验等做法实在是不怎么妥当。假如有人把智能障碍人士关到 动物园，或用来做活体实验，一定会被谴责的。那为什么对于智商不比智障人 士差的这些动物做这些伤害，就那么心安理得？我觉得人对于这些动物的看法 就跟以前的奴隶主看待奴隶一样，认为天生就比人家高一等，他们就是该被人 们奴役玩弄的。 --一叶 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 10 18:51:35 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA26895 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 20:51:35 -0500 Received: (qmail 28340 invoked by uid 108); 11 Apr 2000 01:50:09 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 29295 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2000 01:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 11 Apr 2000 01:52:18 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id JAA02153 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:47:16 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 13 Apr 1999 02:12:16 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA670 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:44:48 +0800 Message-ID: <000801bfa357$d059ede0$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <3.0.6.32.20000409070944.007eecb0@mail.funtv.com> <001101bfa2aa$ede96820$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:46:53 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 49 - http://www.xys.org > 自己的文明。三个猿人科学家乘飞船穿越时空来到地球，被人类抓住。在飞船 > 里发现的猿自然很奇怪，于是就对他们进行研究。 :我记得最后的那个猿人留下了一个小猿，不知现在他长大没有:-) ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 11 13:16:54 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA31561 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 15:16:54 -0500 Received: (qmail 13912 invoked by uid 108); 11 Apr 2000 20:15:17 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 29162 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2000 20:18:27 -0000 Received: from web3002.mail.yahoo.com (204.71.202.165) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 11 Apr 2000 20:18:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 11384 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Apr 2000 20:13:26 -0000 Message-ID: <20000411201326.11383.qmail@web3002.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [129.124.44.164] by web3002.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:13:26 PDT Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:13:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Fuzzify Subject: [xys_friends] how to translate 肝硬化? To: xys_friends@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 50 - http://www.xys.org Can anyone tell me how to translate 肝硬化 into English? Thanks. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 11 13:23:24 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA31620 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 15:23:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 14007 invoked by uid 108); 11 Apr 2000 20:21:47 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 6458 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2000 20:21:30 -0000 Received: from mail.fameccanica.it (HELO intrasvil.fameccanica.com) (151.4.111.197) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 11 Apr 2000 20:21:30 -0000 Subject: Rif: [xys_friends] how to translate =?iso-8859-1?q?=B8=CE=D3=B2=BB=AF?= =?us-ascii?q?=3F?= To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.2c (Intl) 10 Ferbraio 2000 Message-ID: From: ye.j@fameccanica.com Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 04:18:40 +0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on intrasvil/fameccanica(Release 5.0.2c (Intl)|2 February 2000) at 11/04/2000 22.18.48 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 51 - http://www.xys.org cirrhosis of the liver ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 11 22:24:16 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA01632 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 00:24:15 -0500 Received: (qmail 25837 invoked by uid 108); 12 Apr 2000 05:22:28 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18951 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2000 05:21:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 12 Apr 2000 05:21:24 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id NAA03419 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 13:20:27 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 14 Apr 1999 05:45:30 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA3664 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 13:17:58 +0800 Message-ID: <000c01bfa43e$c0446a60$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <0FSP00DPCHZXSQ@email.cta.cq.cn> Subject: [xys_friends] A novel Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 13:19:59 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 52 - http://www.xys.org 一 个 奇 怪 的 故 事 （著）欧·亨利 （译）武 慧 芳 （选录自时代文艺版《欧·亨利全集》第三卷第八部《滚石》） 在奥斯汀北部，曾住着一户诚实的斯莫泽尔姓人家。当给一篇 专门的捧场文章提供人数时，他们报的是六人，即约翰·斯莫泽尔， 他的妻子，他自己，他们五岁的女儿和女儿的父母。但实际数一下， 却只有三人。 一天晚上，晚饭后，小女孩儿突然肚子很痛，于是约翰·斯莫 泽尔就匆匆进城买药去了。 从此，他再也没有回来。 小女孩儿的病好了，后来长成了大姑娘。 母亲因丈夫的失踪而异常悲伤，近乎三个月之后，她才再嫁，搬 至圣安东尼奥去了。 小女孩儿后来也结了婚。几年后，她也有了个五岁的小女孩儿。 她仍然住在她父亲失踪时他们住的那所房子里。 一天晚上，说来非常巧合，在约翰·斯莫泽尔失踪的纪念日，她 的小女孩儿患了痉挛性腹痛。约翰·斯莫泽尔如果还活着，且有一份 固定的工作，应该时她的外祖父了。 “我去城里给她买点儿药吧。”约翰·史密斯说（因为那正是她 所嫁的人。） “不，不，亲爱的约翰，”他妻子喊道，“你也可能永远失踪， 忘了回来。” 就这么地，约翰·史密斯没有出去。他们一起坐在了小潘茜的床 边。（因为那是潘茜的名字。） 过了一会儿，潘茜似乎痛得更厉害了。 约翰·史密斯又要去买 药，但他的妻子不让他去。 突然，门开了。一位长着长长白发的驼背老人进了屋。 “喂，是外公来了。”潘茜说道。她最先认出了他。 老人从兜里拿出一瓶药来，喂了潘茜一勺。 她马上就好了。 “我有点儿来迟了，” 约翰·斯莫泽尔说道，“因为我在等市内 有轨电车。” ———————————————————————————————— 昨天等了一小时公共汽车后，回家看到了这篇小说，就录了 下来——肖毛 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 12 05:57:41 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA02814 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 07:57:40 -0500 Received: (qmail 17416 invoked by uid 108); 12 Apr 2000 12:56:06 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 14860 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2000 12:59:22 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 12 Apr 2000 12:59:22 -0000 Received: from default (putc221612001205.cts.com [216.120.1.205]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA60298 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:54:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000412055033.007efd30@mail.funtv.com> X-Sender: sfang@mail.funtv.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 05:50:33 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 读书论坛 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 53 - http://www.xys.org 国内的网友请试试看能不能从新语丝国内版“新到资料” 左边的链接进入“读书论坛”和“学术论坛”。 方舟子 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 12 06:38:01 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA03054 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 08:38:00 -0500 Received: (qmail 7850 invoked by uid 108); 12 Apr 2000 13:36:22 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 22810 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2000 13:36:05 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 12 Apr 2000 13:36:05 -0000 Received: from default (putc221612001205.cts.com [216.120.1.205]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA61861 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 06:34:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000412063043.007efa20@mail.funtv.com> X-Sender: sfang@mail.funtv.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 06:30:43 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 进化论推荐书目 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 54 - http://www.xys.org 附录三、推荐书目 【图书】 达尔文的《物种起源》是每一位对进化论感兴趣的读者都应该细读的。与科 学史上的其他名著不同，这是一本面向广大读者的通俗著作，而且其基本内容至 今没有过时。不过，其中也有些小错误，最好能参照专家的导读。尽管达尔文本 人对自己的写作能力并不满意，其实他的文笔非常的好。遗憾的是，这部经典著 作至今缺少准确、晓畅的中文译本。在本书完成后，我将着手翻译《物种起源》 第一版本。达尔文的另一本著作《人类的由来与性选择》也值得一读。 在二十世纪又出现了一些对进化论的研究发生了重大影响的著作。但是， 这些著作基本上都是技术性很强的学术专著，不适合于一般的读者阅读。爱德华· 威尔逊的《社会生物学：新综合》是一个例外，与《物质起源》类似，它是一本 有极高的学术价值，又有很强的可读性的著作（威尔逊同时是一个著名作家，两 度获得美国文学的最高奖普利策奖）。就引起了激烈争议而言，它也算得上是 《物种起源》在二十世纪的继承者。该书试图将进化生物学与社会科学相结合， 出版于1975年。原著篇幅宏大，另有一个缩写本更适合一般读者。这个缩写本有 一个不是很理想的中文节译本。 威尔逊《社会生物学：缩写本》（1980） Sociobiology: The Abridged Edition Edward O. Wilson. Harvard University Press. 下面推荐一些十几年来出版的、面向广大读者的进化论新著。这些都是从我 个人藏书中挑选出来的。 当代进化论理论家中，对我影响较大的为迈尔（Earnst Mayr）、梅格纳· 史密斯（John Maynard Smith）和爱德华·威尔逊（Edward O. Wison）。他们 也写一些普及性的读物。最近的包括： 迈尔《一个长篇争辩：查尔斯·达尔文和现代进化思想的诞生》（1991） One Long Argument: Charles Darwin and the Genesis of Modern Evolutionary Thought Ernst Mayr. Harvard University Press. 迈尔《这是生物学：生命世界的科学》（1997） This is Biology: the Science of the Living World Ernst Mayr. Harvard University Press. 梅格纳·史密斯《塑造生命：基因，胚胎和进化》（1999） Shaping Life: Genes, Embryos and Evolution John Maynard Smith. Yale University Press. 梅格纳·史密斯（合著）《生命的起源：从生命的诞生到语言的起源》（1999） The Origins of Life: From the birth of life to the origin of language John Maynard Smith and Eors Szathmary. Oxford University Press. 爱德华·威尔逊《生命的多样性》（1992） The Diversity of Life Edward O. Wilson. Harvard University Press. 爱德华·威尔逊《一致：知识的统一》（1998） Consilience: The Unity of Knowledge Edward O. Wilson. Random House 古尔德（Stephen Jay Gould）和道金斯（Richard Dawkins）是当代重 要且多产的进化论科普作家。古尔德的著作基本上是其专栏文章的合集，而 道金斯的著作则都是有系统的论著。在这里我特别推荐道金斯的几本著作： 道金斯《自私的基因》（第二版，1989） The Selfish Gene (2nd edition) Richard Dawkins. Oxford University Press 道金斯《盲目的表匠》（1988） The Blind Watchmaker Richard Dawkins. Penguin. 道金斯《流出伊甸的河流》（1995） River Out of Eden Richard Dawkins. Phoenix. 关于达尔文进化论对人类思想、社会的重大影响，可看这两本由哲学家撰 写的著作： 德尼特《达尔文的危险观念：进化以及生命的意义》（1995） Darwin's Dangerous Idea: Evolution and the Meanings of Life Daniel C. Dennett. Touchtone Book. 路斯《认真对待达尔文：一种自然主义的哲学观》（1998） Taking Darwin Seriously: A Naturalistic Approach to Philosophy Michael Ruse. Prometheus Books. 对当代神创论的驳斥，可看参考下面这本简明的指南： 贝拉《进化以及神创论的神话》（1990） Evolution and the Myth of Creationism Tim M. Berra. Stanford University Press. 下面这本图文并茂的普及性著作对进化论的发现历程做了详细的回顾： 扬《进化的发现》（1992） The Discovery of Evolution David Young. Cambridge University Press. 目前最好的达尔文传记是： 德斯门德、莫尔《达尔文》（1992） Darwin Adrian Desmond and James Moor. Penguin. 下面这本是目前最好的一本进化生物学教材。作者采用分专题讨论的形式， 从最基本的知识介绍开始，逐步引向最前沿的研究，适合于各种程度的读者。 里德利《进化》（第二版，1996） Evolution (2nd edition) Mark Ridley. Blackwell. 下面这本是英国当代古脊椎动物学的权威帕特森的绝笔（作者在该书完稿 三天后去世），简明、生动地介绍了进化论的基础知识和最新成果，以及作者 对进化论的一些独特看法。 帕特森《进化》（第二版，1999） Evolution (2nd edition) Colin Patterson. Cornell University Press. 诺贝尔奖获得者、比利时细胞学家德杜夫在下面这本书中，以生物化学为 基础，概述了地球生命的起源和进化历程： 德杜夫《活力之尘：生命做为宇宙之必然》（1995） Vital Dust: Life as a Cosmic Imperative Christian de Duve. Basic Books. “科学美国人文库”（Scientific American Library）是一套图文并茂、 印刷精美的科普丛书，其中与进化论有关的两本优秀著作特别值得推荐： 《性选择：自然界中的择偶和求爱》（1997） Sexual Selection: Mate Choice and Courtship in Nature James L. Gould and Carol Grant Gould. Scientific American Library. 列文《进化的模式：新的分子观点》（1997） Patterns in Evolution: The New Molecular View Roger Lewin. Scientific American Library. 关于人类进化的佳作非常多。最值得一读的有： 戴门德《第三种黑猩猩：人类动物的进化和未来》（1992） The Third Chimpanzee: The Evolution and Future of the Human Animal Jared Diamond. Harper Perennial. 威尔斯《失控的脑：人类独特性的进化》（1993） The Runaway Brain: The Evolution of Human Uniqueness Christopher Wills. Basic Books. 里查德·利基《人类的起源》（1994） The Origin of Humankind Richard Leakey. Basic Books. 塔特萨尔《成为人：进化和人类的独特性》（1998） Becoming Human: Evolution and Human Uniqueness Ian Tattersall. Harvest. 下面这本书详细地记述了一些最著名的猿人化石的发现经过： 里德《缺环：寻找最早的人》（1990） Missing Links: The Hunt for Earliest Man John Reader. Penguin. 下面这本颇为有趣的小册子讨论了人类性特征的进化： 戴门德《为什么性是有趣的？人类性特征的进化》（1997） Why is Sex Fun? The Evolution of Human Sexuality Jared Diamond. Basic Books. 【刊物】 进化论的研究日新月异，昨天的定论今天可能就有了问题。因此，除了阅读 有关著作，还应该阅读学术、科普刊物留心最新的进展。 《自然》（Nature）和《科学》（Science）是最权威的国际学术刊物，但 也有一部分短小的新闻、综述文章是面向外行读者的，其中基本上每期都有一篇 与进化生物学有关。 《科学美国人》（Scientific American）是最好的科普杂志，每年也会有 十来篇与进化论有关的科普文章，由各个领域的专家介绍最新的进展。自1974年 起，斯蒂芬·古尔德在《自然史》（Natural History）杂志上开设一个名为“这 个生命观”的专栏，每月一篇介绍进化论的历史和进展。《发现》（Discover） 是另一种很好的科普杂志，较为浅显，也经常有与进化论有关的新闻报道、科普 文章。 【网站】 “谈论·起源”（talk.origins）新闻组是国际互联网上用英文辩论进化论 和神创论的主要场所。它的网站收集了进化论这方的许多资料，包括进化论常识 介绍和对神创论的批驳，均为专家撰写。该网站也收集了许多有用的相关链接。 “谈论·起源”新闻组网站： http://www.talkorigins.org 我的个人网页收集了我撰写的一些科普作品，大部分与进化论有关。据我所 知，目前中文网络上还没有类似的网站。国内读者可能只能看到其国内版。 “方舟子科普作品”： http://www.xys.org/~fang/science.html （国际版） http://www.xys2.org/fang/science.html （国内版） ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 12 17:21:25 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA06460 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 19:21:24 -0500 Message-Id: <200004130021.TAA06460@xys.xys.org> Received: (qmail 12810 invoked by uid 108); 13 Apr 2000 00:19:45 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 1622 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2000 00:17:59 -0000 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.32) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 13 Apr 2000 00:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO public) (61.128.153.11) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Apr 2000 17:17:39 -0700 X-Apparently-From: Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 8:22:53 +0800 From: tanglang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: [xys_friends] sent again X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id TAA06460 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 55 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-12 13:19:00 jccb4写道： > 一 个 奇 怪 的 故 事 > > （著）欧·亨利 > （译）武 慧 芳 > > “我有点儿来迟了，” 约翰·斯莫泽尔说道，“因为我在等市内 >有轨电车。” >———————————————————————————————— > 昨天等了一小时公共汽车后，回家看到了这篇小说，就录了 >下来——肖毛 非常有趣的小说。：）我们这儿准备建地铁，有个站口就在我们院 附近。如果有一天我突然失踪，大概是去等那个地铁去了。：） 估计也不会很久，地铁站口整天施工，很好看，每次路过我都要去 张望两眼。我有个恶习，就是喜欢看别人干活，特别是体力活。给 地主当监工是个不错的职业，我常想。 我有个同事，常说她最大的理想就是当个地主婆，尤其是看了《甲 方乙方》之后，对刘蓓的那句台词“地主家也没余粮啊”感到非常 亲切。 想想一般人的理想其实都很简单，也很现实。 我下个星期有可能去北京开会，学术会，我估计我会开上一天半天 会的，但绝不可能全坐在会场里。所以，如果有北京的网友想当面 批评我的，可以给我电话号码以供联系。如果有不打算批评我甚至 准备请我吃饭的，我可以酌情透露一些惊人的网人幕后故事——比 如说一华的某些不检点行为，等——给你们听。 螳螂 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 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It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 12 17:50:04 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA06621 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 19:50:03 -0500 Received: (qmail 6767 invoked by uid 108); 13 Apr 2000 01:07:56 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 21326 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2000 00:46:13 -0000 Received: from web3904.mail.yahoo.com (204.71.203.200) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 13 Apr 2000 00:46:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20000413004439.19427.qmail@web3904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.111.146.37] by web3904.mail.yahoo.com; Thu, 13 Apr 2000 08:44:39 CST Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 08:44:39 +0800 (CST) From: =?gb2312?q?=D1=EE=20=B5=C2=EE=C8?= Subject: Re: [xys_friends] sent again To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 56 - http://www.xys.org --- tanglang 书写： > - http://www.xys.org > > > > 在 00-4-12 13:19:00 jccb4写道： > > 一 个 奇 怪 的 故 事 > 如果有不打算批评我甚至 > 准备请我吃饭的，我可以酌情透露一些惊人的网人幕后故事——比如说一华的某些不检点行为，等——给你们听。 > > > 螳螂 > > 很愿意听你讲惊人的网人幕后故事。但请客的事，似乎非钱不能，所以我愿意——只听。 公羊 > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, write to > xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Advertisement: > Workstation with Monitor under $800! > So, you just heard that you need to add how many new > workstations by > the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It > includes > everything you need to get everyone up and running > quickly. > http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 登录免费电邮帐号 Get your free @yahoo.com.CN address at http://mail.yahoo.com.cn ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 12 18:31:11 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA06850 for ; Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:31:11 -0500 Message-Id: <200004130131.UAA06850@xys.xys.org> Received: (qmail 9579 invoked by uid 108); 13 Apr 2000 01:29:36 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 29304 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2000 01:28:48 -0000 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.32) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 13 Apr 2000 01:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO public) (61.128.158.145) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Apr 2000 18:27:43 -0700 X-Apparently-From: Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 9:32:56 +0800 From: tanglang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: Re: [xys_friends] sent again X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id UAA06850 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 57 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-13 8:44:00 =?gb2312?q?=D1=EE=20=B5=C2=EE=C8?=写道： >> 在 00-4-12 13:19:00 jccb4写道： >> > 一 个 奇 怪 的 故 事 >> >如果有不打算批评我甚至 >> >准备请我吃饭的，我可以酌情透露一些惊人的网人幕后故事——比如说一华的某些不检点行为，等——给你 们听。 >> >> >> 螳螂 >> >> >很愿意听你讲惊人的网人幕后故事。但请客的事，似乎非钱不能，所以我愿意——只听。 > > 公羊 公羊在北京吗？如果方便的话，私下给个电话号码吧。 钱的事好说，新语丝的200美圆过不了多久就会汇出了。：） 先透露一个小内幕，现在正在设计奖状，具体设计者是谁， 请了客就告诉你。：） 螳螂 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 14 13:50:18 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA17288 for ; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:50:17 -0500 Received: (qmail 5878 invoked by uid 108); 14 Apr 2000 20:48:47 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 24381 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2000 20:46:36 -0000 Received: from mail.ttlc.net (208.130.9.4) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 14 Apr 2000 20:46:36 -0000 Received: from msp [206.151.172.87] by mail.ttlc.net (SMTPD32-6.00) id A49E83D0116; Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:50:38 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000414165108.007cac80@mail.ttlc.net> X-Sender: yige@mail.ttlc.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:51:08 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: yige Subject: [xys_friends] 大出血 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 58 - http://www.xys.org 这个星期美国股市上尸积如山，血流漂杵。上个 星期还是个百万富翁的，现在恐怕只是个十万元 户了。上个星期有十万的，现在恐怕已倒欠十万 了。谁若是借了钱在那儿玩的，恐怕已经快玩完 了。只可惜了个新浪网，流年不利，碰到这会儿 才撞进来，若是去年，第一天就能上一百，可惜 迟了，我刚十九块半进了一些，算是爱国吧：－） 想起有关股市的一个笑话，好象以前有说过： 两哥们一起浩叹股市如何如何无情，一个说 他为了股市，整夜整夜睡不着。另一个说： “我倒是没严重到那个地步，只不过偶尔会 在梦中惊哭一下而已”：－） ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 15 02:25:55 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA19787 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 04:25:54 -0500 Received: (qmail 3314 invoked by uid 0); 15 Apr 2000 09:31:52 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 3671 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2000 09:24:07 -0000 Received: from web3901.mail.yahoo.com (204.71.203.197) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 15 Apr 2000 09:24:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20000415092230.22257.qmail@web3901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.111.146.29] by web3901.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 17:22:30 CST Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 17:22:30 +0800 (CST) From: =?gb2312?q?=D1=EE=20=B5=C2=EE=C8?= Subject: Re: Re: [xys_friends] sent again To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 59 - http://www.xys.org 一 个 奇 怪 的 故 事 > 公羊在北京吗？如果方便的话，私下给个电话号码吧。 > > 螳螂 > > 公羊不在北京，且“公羊讨厌北京”。这只是一个题目，以后我会细陈原因。所以我也只能用眼睛听呀。不过你如果碰巧来到河南的一个城市，我会很乐意尽一下地主之宜（意？）——即便你不告诉我劳什子内幕或外幕。：） 那时我们会进一个馆子，——我要跟你许拽一下——或许能用上招待政府官员的那一套。 要了小姐，点了菜，这时你不妨假意推辞一下，比如菜太多吃不了之类。我会说，吃不吃——先摆上。 上了菜，接着是酒，不会太好，最高不超过茅台水平，你还得接着表演，表示自己量如何小或根本不沾酒。我会说，喝不喝——先倒上。 酒足饭饱，当然要进舞厅，还需要你继续配合，眼睛瞪着给你挑好的小姐说不跳不跳，我会硬把她的小手塞给你说，跳不跳——先搂上。 跳过舞，出了一身汗，旁边就是桑那或洗脚城，我会直接把你领进去，你假戏尽管做到底。我会说，洗不洗——先泡上。 洗过后，就是异性按摩，这时候不需指点，小姐会直接扒光你的衣服，你也许真的会难为情，因为那时侯可能我们同在一个房间，仅隔了一张帘子，我当然要鼓励你，干不干——先套上。 也许到完事你酒仍未醒，春宵一刻使你乐而忘蜀，劝你不走，且把酒气喷到我的脸上。能在一起供这等事情，相当于十五年交情，当然我们已经很熟了，我会且哄且劝搀着你的胳膊到车旁说，走不走——先坐上。 好咧，完事咧。你可以坐上飞机，过你的云游日子了。：） 公羊戏撰 > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, write to > xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Advertisement: > Workstation with Monitor under $800! > So, you just heard that you need to add how many new > workstations by > the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It > includes > everything you need to get everyone up and running > quickly. > http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 登录免费电邮帐号 Get your free @yahoo.com.CN address at http://mail.yahoo.com.cn ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 15 08:32:37 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA20778 for ; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 10:32:36 -0500 Received: (qmail 3953 invoked by uid 108); 15 Apr 2000 15:30:51 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 3661 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2000 15:29:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 15 Apr 2000 15:29:42 -0000 Received: from jshaw ([61.128.147.87]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FT200E95DIC5F@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:25:25 +0800 (CST) Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 23:41:51 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: Re: Re: Re: [xys_friends] sent again To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FT200E96DIC5F@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 60 - http://www.xys.org >公羊不在北京，且“公羊讨厌北京”。这只是一个题目，以后我会细陈原因。所以我也只能用眼睛听呀。不过你如果碰巧来到河南的一个城市， 我会很乐意尽一下地主之宜（意？）——即便你不告诉我劳什子内幕或外幕。：） >那时我们会进一个馆子，——我要跟你许拽一下——或许能用上招待政府官员的那一套。 >要了小姐，点了菜，这时你不妨假意推辞一下，比如菜太多吃不了之类。我会说，吃不吃——先摆上。 >上了菜，接着是酒，不会太好，最高不超过茅台水平，你还得接着表演，表示自己量如何小或根本不沾酒。我会说，喝不喝——先倒上。 >酒足饭饱，当然要进舞厅，还需要你继续配合，眼睛瞪着给你挑好的小姐说不跳不跳，我会硬把她的小手塞给你说，跳不跳——先搂上。 >跳过舞，出了一身汗，旁边就是桑那或洗脚城，我会直接把你领进去，你假戏尽管做到底。我会说，洗不洗——先泡上。 >洗过后，就是异性按摩，这时候不需指点，小姐会直接扒光你的衣服，你也许真的会难为情，因为那时侯可能我们同在一个房间，仅隔了一张帘 子，我当然要鼓励你，干不干——先套上。 >也许到完事你酒仍未醒，春宵一刻使你乐而忘蜀，劝你不走，且把酒气喷到我的脸上。能在一起供这等事情，相当于十五年交情，当然我们已经 很熟了，我会且哄且劝搀着你的胳膊到车旁说，走不走——先坐上。 >好咧，完事咧。你可以坐上飞机，过你的云游日子了。：） > > 公羊戏撰 我的天！还有这么好玩的事情，得，我把北京的票退了，直接奔河南。：） 有一次同学聚会，我们一大伙子人包了间卡厅，是地下室那种的， 我们又唱又跳的，煞是热闹，不过都是内部解决，男同学女同学 的，歌声传情，但动作呆板。卡厅的另一角坐着几个小姐，满脸 的愤怒与不屑，我偶尔听见了她们的窃窃私语：妈的，这帮土包 子！换个地方吧。没多久她们摔摔打打地就走了。：） 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 15 23:59:43 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA23339 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:59:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 24159 invoked by uid 108); 16 Apr 2000 07:17:47 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 28388 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2000 06:56:59 -0000 Received: from web3005.mail.yahoo.com (204.71.202.168) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 16 Apr 2000 06:56:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 23382 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Apr 2000 06:56:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20000416065615.23381.qmail@web3005.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.108.137.154] by web3005.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:56:15 PDT Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:56:15 -0700 (PDT) From: =?gb2312?q?xiangchuan=20Fan?= Subject: [xys_friends] visit Beijing To: xys_friends@listbot.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 61 - http://www.xys.org 螳螂要来北京，是不是我也应该尽尽地主之谊？心里一直在嘀咕。 看了公羊EMAIL的前两句，想想自己也应该做点什么，早起草拟了 这个旅游建议。看完公羊的帖子，我的天！贴上我的让大家换换 感觉吧。 北京一周游建议： 1，最老套又好象就是应该看的一景，去天安门看升降国旗，游故宫， 不管社会怎么变，等着看升旗的人总有很多。这项活动值得花一天的 时间，要穿一双能走路的鞋，做好走很多路，喝很多水的思想准备：-）， 北京的天气早晚很凉，白天很热。 有一次听一个导游说，他曾经在里面待了一个星期，也没有完全逛完 故宫：-）。 2，清华北大和他们旁边的书店，风入松，图书城对面那个叫什么来着？ 真的很大，每次走进他们的地下室，看见那么多书，就有一种所有的 脑细胞都被激活充满的感觉，阅读环境很宽松，只要你能找到位置，可 以一直看书，书店里有饮料和汉堡。 如果有时间，可以再逛逛中关村的电子市场。 3，去长安大戏院看京剧， 4，去嘉里中心观光独具特色热带风格的饭店。 5，如果能51以后离开，参加第二届司马台长城万人徒步行。 6，帮螳嫂买东西时，去大商场顶楼吃饭，方便好找，价钱公道， 操作公开，一般有各地特色菜，川菜只走样一点点：-） 北京烤鸭这个问题：-），我带了两个人吃，都说很难吃，前门的烤 鸭也许可以放弃了：-），东三环边上有一家不错，如果你有雅兴， 我可以去问来地址：-）。 7，螳螂是一个人来还是和同事一起来？花钱不能完全依赖卡，银行的 机器保不准会在你最需要钱的时候坏。要带一些现金，但也别多了。 天黑最好别出门，遇上歹徒沉着镇定。 另：有沙尘暴时千万别出门，开会，或者逛一天商店；没有时，春光 明媚再逛外景。 8，有一本北京人手册（bjrsc.com.cn），印刷本书上的信息很实用， 从坐公交车到娱乐，民航班车，反扒窃举报，联系电话，乘车路线，景 点门票，特色，一应俱全。 网上北京地图：http://go2map.sina.com.cn/ 现在忙得四脚朝天，最好连屏幕也不看：-） 古人说，“无是非之到耳，谓之福” 螳螂不想也享享清福？：-） __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 06:24:14 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA24281 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 08:24:14 -0500 Received: (qmail 24346 invoked by uid 108); 16 Apr 2000 13:21:39 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12414 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2000 13:19:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.111) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 16 Apr 2000 13:19:53 -0000 Received: from jshaw ([61.128.146.164]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FT4001IY24IL5@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 21:14:43 +0800 (CST) Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:31:14 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] visit Beijing To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FT4001IZ24IL5@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 62 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-15 23:56:00 =?gb2312?q?xiangchuan=20Fan?=写道： > - http://www.xys.org > >螳螂要来北京，是不是我也应该尽尽地主之谊？心里一直在嘀咕。 呵呵，自然，我请你，如果你有空。：） >看了公羊EMAIL的前两句，想想自己也应该做点什么，早起草拟了 >这个旅游建议。看完公羊的帖子，我的天！贴上我的让大家换换 >感觉吧。 > >北京一周游建议： > >1，最老套又好象就是应该看的一景，去天安门看升降国旗，游故宫， >不管社会怎么变，等着看升旗的人总有很多。这项活动值得花一天的 >时间，要穿一双能走路的鞋，做好走很多路，喝很多水的思想准备：-）， >北京的天气早晚很凉，白天很热。 > >有一次听一个导游说，他曾经在里面待了一个星期，也没有完全逛完 >故宫：-）。 故宫我都逛过好几回了，第一次去故宫时我大概才十岁。最近一次 是四年前。最喜欢逛的地方是珍宝馆。尽管也看不到什么好珍宝了。 >2，清华北大和他们旁边的书店，风入松，图书城对面那个叫什么来着？ >真的很大，每次走进他们的地下室，看见那么多书，就有一种所有的 >脑细胞都被激活充满的感觉，阅读环境很宽松，只要你能找到位置，可 >以一直看书，书店里有饮料和汉堡。 > >如果有时间，可以再逛逛中关村的电子市场。 > >3，去长安大戏院看京剧， >4，去嘉里中心观光独具特色热带风格的饭店。 >5，如果能51以后离开，参加第二届司马台长城万人徒步行。 > >6，帮螳嫂买东西时，去大商场顶楼吃饭，方便好找，价钱公道， >操作公开，一般有各地特色菜，川菜只走样一点点：-） 让我逛商场，不如把我杀了。：） >北京烤鸭这个问题：-），我带了两个人吃，都说很难吃，前门的烤 >鸭也许可以放弃了：-），东三环边上有一家不错，如果你有雅兴， >我可以去问来地址：-）。 北京烤鸭我也不怎么喜欢吃。我喜欢吃涮羊肉，但现在似乎不是 季节。 >7，螳螂是一个人来还是和同事一起来？花钱不能完全依赖卡，银行的 >机器保不准会在你最需要钱的时候坏。要带一些现金，但也别多了。 >天黑最好别出门，遇上歹徒沉着镇定。 遇到歹徒我会毫不犹豫地把钱给他或她。：）不过，我们有一 大堆同事一起去开会，遇到这种情况的概率可能不多。呵呵， 会场也是显示单位实力的地方。：） >另：有沙尘暴时千万别出门，开会，或者逛一天商店；没有时，春光 >明媚再逛外景。 沙尘暴也是一景啊。 >8，有一本北京人手册（bjrsc.com.cn），印刷本书上的信息很实用， >从坐公交车到娱乐，民航班车，反扒窃举报，联系电话，乘车路线，景 >点门票，特色，一应俱全。 > >网上北京地图：http://go2map.sina.com.cn/ > >现在忙得四脚朝天，最好连屏幕也不看：-） >古人说，“无是非之到耳，谓之福” >螳螂不想也享享清福？：-） 好啊，竟敢说我们伟大的首都是是非之地。好久没政治学习了 吧？：） 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 11:08:43 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA25203 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:08:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 29378 invoked by uid 108); 16 Apr 2000 18:07:03 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 21235 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2000 17:19:39 -0000 Received: from law-f289.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.130.228) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 16 Apr 2000 17:19:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 89376 invoked by uid 0); 16 Apr 2000 17:18:34 -0000 Message-ID: <20000416171834.89375.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 18.251.1.122 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:18:34 PDT X-Originating-IP: [18.251.1.122] From: "Muzi Muzi" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] visit Beijing Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:18:34 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 63 - http://www.xys.org > >有一次听一个导游说，他曾经在里面待了一个星期，也没有完全逛完 > >故宫：-）。 > >故宫我都逛过好几回了，第一次去故宫时我大概才十岁。最近一次 >是四年前。最喜欢逛的地方是珍宝馆。尽管也看不到什么好珍宝了。 我一个同学家离故宫不远, 他说, 你有没有在故宫快关门的时候进去过? 五点关门,你四点从天安门那边或者北边那个大门进去, 一个钟头之内从另一个 门走出来. 因为大多游客去得早以便一天游完, 到四点左右一般就没什么人了. 想象一下只有你自己一人行走于宫殿之间, 仿佛偌大的故宫只属于你一人, 大概可以体会一下百年前那种肃静... 他讲这话是十年前的事了. 令我着实心向往之, 终究未曾尝试过. 不知道现在 是否仍然可行, 或许螳螂可以试试. 暮紫 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 17:14:09 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA26511 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 19:14:09 -0500 Received: (qmail 29960 invoked by uid 108); 17 Apr 2000 00:12:43 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27976 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 00:16:05 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 00:16:05 -0000 Received: from default (putc2218123.cts.com [209.68.218.123]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA46255 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:10:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000416170654.0084ecc0@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: smfang@pop.mail.yahoo.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:06:54 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 64 - http://www.xys.org 自前天起Yahoo!改换界面后，就一直要我交信用卡 验证年龄，真是莫名其妙。我改用hotmail.com了。 这是我进入以后显示的。我记得清清楚楚我是填的 真生日，而且就算填错了，也不能说让我用了一年 多了，才来提苛刻要求吧。别人有没这种情况？ Please get your parent's permission soon to avoid interruptions with account access. But, I am an adult. Verify your age by credit card. Why does Yahoo! think I'm a child? Perhaps you signed up with a child's birthdate. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 17:47:53 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail2.listbot.com ([204.71.191.24]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA26615 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 19:47:52 -0500 Message-Id: <200004170047.TAA26615@xys.xys.org> Received: (qmail 5411 invoked by uid 108); 17 Apr 2000 00:46:12 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 16570 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 00:49:46 -0000 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.32) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 00:49:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO public) (61.128.146.223) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Apr 2000 17:44:26 -0700 X-Apparently-From: Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 8:49:42 +0800 From: tanglang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: [xys_friends] Yahoo!=D4=DA=B8=C9=CA=B2=C3=B4=A3=BF?= X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id TAA26615 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 65 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-16 17:06:00 Shi-min Fang写道： > - http://www.xys.org > >自前天起Yahoo!改换界面后，就一直要我交信用卡 >验证年龄，真是莫名其妙。我改用hotmail.com了。 > >这是我进入以后显示的。我记得清清楚楚我是填的 >真生日，而且就算填错了，也不能说让我用了一年 >多了，才来提苛刻要求吧。别人有没这种情况？ 是不是谁帮你把个人信息给改了？ >Please get your parent's >permission soon to avoid >interruptions with account >access. > > >But, I am an adult. >Verify your age by credit card. > >Why does Yahoo! think I'm a child? >Perhaps you signed up with a child's birthdate. > > >______________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com >Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb 螳螂 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 18:53:47 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA26903 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:53:46 -0500 Message-Id: <200004170153.UAA26903@xys.xys.org> Received: (qmail 23937 invoked by uid 0); 17 Apr 2000 01:59:46 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18019 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 01:36:46 -0000 Received: from smtp.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.32) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 01:36:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO public) (61.128.151.148) by smtp.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Apr 2000 18:31:23 -0700 X-Apparently-From: Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 9:36:38 +0800 From: tanglang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: Re: [xys_friends] visit Beijing X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id UAA26903 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 66 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-16 17:18:00 Muzi Muzi写道： > - http://www.xys.org > >> >有一次听一个导游说，他曾经在里面待了一个星期，也没有完全逛完 >> >故宫：-）。 >> >>故宫我都逛过好几回了，第一次去故宫时我大概才十岁。最近一次 >>是四年前。最喜欢逛的地方是珍宝馆。尽管也看不到什么好珍宝了。 > >我一个同学家离故宫不远, 他说, 你有没有在故宫快关门的时候进去过? >五点关门,你四点从天安门那边或者北边那个大门进去, 一个钟头之内从另一个 >门走出来. 因为大多游客去得早以便一天游完, 到四点左右一般就没什么人了. >想象一下只有你自己一人行走于宫殿之间, 仿佛偌大的故宫只属于你一人, >大概可以体会一下百年前那种肃静... > >他讲这话是十年前的事了. 令我着实心向往之, 终究未曾尝试过. 不知道现在 >是否仍然可行, 或许螳螂可以试试. > >暮紫 谢谢暮紫。：） 如有机会，我定当一试。游览古迹，最好的心情当是孤寂。只是现如今， 个个如庙会赶场般的热闹，游客的兴趣多是拍照和听导游讲一些野史故 事。没了兴致。 螳螂 下面这段可能没在这儿贴过。 -------------------------------------------------------- 一九八四年七月三日零时岗哨 在无月的夜里，听郊野里疏落的蛙鸣和此起彼伏的虫声。天上的云， 絮般的撕开，缝隙间几颗清凉的星光，照得地也清凉。 彻夜不息黄且昏的灯拖长了松树的影，和着地上的泥泞，凑成几幅 怪诞的水墨。 今天傍晚那一残段彩虹呢？那汉皇的墓边，拔地而起，却在半空中 被狠狠截断的七彩光柱，原来是虹啊！我只当儿时所见到的，那把 雨后雷公悬于天际的彩弓才是虹；那渡着仙人光怪陆离的金桥才是 虹。 不要用手指虹，那只手指那只手要烂的。带着嘻笑的忠告，没人会 信，但的确有许多人垂下了手臂，弯起了手指。 从半睡眠状态中泛起的思绪象断线风筝的游丝。 有轻盈的脚步，有稚气的笑靥，有空幻的向往，有深沉的思索，有 焦躁彷徨的期待，有浅薄无聊的巧辩，有强颜欢笑的逢场作戏，有 自以为是的空泛情志，有惆怅和沮丧，有怒怨和愤恨。。。 我忏悔，在天上地下同样的黑暗，却依然有几点亮光的地方，我以 半清醒的心灵忏悔我的过去现在，直至未来。 一九八四年六月二十二日流行病学及水质调查途中 带着欣赏，而不是虔诚的崇拜，移近。终于，在朦朦的雨雾中，古 塔显现了。珠顶，飞檐，悬铃，继而是整个青灰的塔身。巍峨，而 且玲珑。七极浮屠，一级级地缠绕着云雾，一弥一合中，透着庄严 的静穆和挺拔的安谧。 一阵斜风，一片细雨，身外的一切变得斑驳陆离。应当是一只无形 的手，神秘地展开，可能是，时间的画卷。 悬钟响了，震荡。梵铃响了，悠扬。木鱼响了，清脆。 还有，宽宏的礼纤吟哦中，无尽的空中缓缓飞过排成人字的雁群。 荷锄的农夫，醉酒的诗人，青的箬笠，绿的蓑衣。无赖浪子，红粉 歌姬，肆意的大笑，滴水的留海。 马蹄答答如密鼓，黑的甲胄白的马旋风般地掠过，惊鸿一瞥中只见 到衔在口中的箭镞和血染的刀锋。 明黄色的伞盖摇曳在古曲的奏中，彩旗里黄白红青驷马拖行着镶金 缵玉的宝车。 枯草野花的墓地里有女子凄切的哭声，白色的飘带，白色的冥纸， 秋风中的残阳，火红的夕照。 历史在一瞬间凝固了世界，这迷茫空灵的雨雾仿佛给宇宙注入了新 的含义，混沌原始却又清白真切，如一发无始终的长箭在冥冥的空 中化为无限。 我尚未成。 ------------------------------------------------------ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 16 20:23:22 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA27265 for ; Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:23:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 10403 invoked by uid 108); 17 Apr 2000 03:21:31 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4269 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 03:20:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 03:20:29 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id LAA08014 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:19:16 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 19 Apr 1999 03:44:30 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA23943 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:16:44 +0800 Message-ID: <002e01bfa81b$a65c1860$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: [xys_friends] About jiangyuheng Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:18:48 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 67 - http://www.xys.org 漂 泊 的 流 浪 者 心 中 无 恨 ——听姜育恒的最新专辑CD《女人的选择》 从1998年起，我共买了十张姜育恒的磁带或CD，它们是：《长青》、《再 回首》、《想哭就哭》、《跟往事干杯》、《心歌》、《旅》、《有空来坐坐》、《一个 人》、《其实我真的很在乎》、《地图》。 最近几年，不见他新唱片的消息，以为他退出歌坛了，没想到昨天居然又 买到了一张他的最新专辑CD《女人的选择》！那么，我就又添了一张姜育恒的 唱片了。 这十多年来，姜育恒唱过的每一首歌我几乎都喜欢听，我想这是因为他的 每支歌都是“心歌”的缘故，所以这张最新的专辑也一样没有让我失望——这 十多年来，从没让我失望过的唱中文的歌手，除了罗大佑，也只有姜育恒了。 每个真正的歌手唱歌都有自己的特点，所以他们的歌声就是他们的“面孔”，而姜育恒 的“面孔”又如何呢？ 每当听姜育恒的歌，我都仿佛看到这样的景象：沙滩，海浪，一个孤独地 坐在辉煌时刻的男人；他看着潮水一波波地涌过来，起初还是轻轻的，柔柔的， 淡淡的，但是声音和气势却越来越大，直到出现一排最大的浪，尽情地激打向 礁石，溅起漫天的云浪，每一滴浪珠里都泛着七彩的光，看得他想哭，想微笑， 又什么都不能想；然后，这些浪又渐渐的散去，一切都趋于平淡，为下一次的 更大的冲击做准备…… 我没有见过海，因此以上的比喻可能与事实不符，但却基本表达了我要说 的意思。姜育恒的歌初听时往往渺不可闻，但不久就如海水决堤一般，声音陡 然增高变烈，所有内心深处最深切的感情都于此时爆发出来，其猛烈的气势不 下于飞流直下三千尺的瀑布，烧红了天空的火山岩浆，能把周围的一切都席卷 进去，冲刷干净，完全融化——然后，一切又渐渐的平静、冷却，变成丁香的 花苞，把苦涩的心香裹在里面，除非五月的风雨来临。 这张专辑的演唱风格也是这样。 现在我正在听的是“昨日的行李”： …… 遗憾的 永远很美丽 我用泪 送你一程 那一段 卿卿我我的日子里 总有一些 值得你回忆 然后是小提琴的弦音，仿佛颤响在天外；还有流水般的钢琴声，跳溅在 你的心键上…然后又是一样低声的演唱，直到这一句时： 说你是一片流云 只能给一些相遇 声音才渐变高亢起来。然后，声音又淡了下来，直到结束，但余音却还 在你的心里。 下面再来听“异乡人”： 开始，姜育恒的声音似乎来自遥远的山谷，可却渐听渐远，以至消失了 痕迹，只剩小提琴与吉他的声音；过了片刻，你才重又听到他的浅吟低唱： 为了爱 尝尽了 春去秋来 缘分谢 花盛开 都是应该 路恒长 夜未央 人孤单 星微亮 去无返 人世片段 音乐声、人声，不急不徐地交融在一起，一同淡淡地吟咏那一场无悔 的爱；偶尔出现的一句高腔，如星光一闪，给你希望，也给你痛苦；但更 多的时候，只是平静的叙述，可我却听得出平静背后的呐喊……这样的歌， 能不打动我的心吗？ 再听“最爱的人”： 路，看不见的尽头 是爱你的乡愁 不能回首，不堪回首 泪眼已朦胧 …… 这首歌有些特别，很多句都是从浅唱开始，但结句却猛然高挑上去，一 下子就勾起了你的情绪，让你的血发热，手发烫；然后，声音又低下去，然 后，又高起来，直到全曲唱完基本都是如此。 爱情难道不就是这样吗？平淡与深刻交织，沉默与爆发共生，痛苦与甜 蜜为邻…… …… 最爱的人 我爱你那么痛 时间对我来说 只剩悔恨和虚空 最后这句里的“时间对我来说”，被一连唱了三遍，一遍比一遍唱得撕 人心脾，可最终还是以一句“只剩悔恨和虚空”结束了——姜育恒怎么忍心 这样？但不这样又能如何？ 现在，我的CD机里正在播放“如今”。这首歌几乎只用吉他伴奏，这可 是我最爱的风格——只听钢琴伴奏我会疯掉，只听吉他伴奏我可会得到莫大 的享受。我仿佛看到了那只拨动吉他的手，那个对着夜空倾诉的人…… …… Yeah,Yeah,Yeah…… 抹不去 痛别离 我爱你 到如今 我愿是 一颗星 远远地 在天际 黑夜中 太孤寂 藉泪光 寻你 那回忆 回不去 如今你 在哪里 接着，是姜育恒自己词曲的一首“歌，说，活。”这首如说如唱的歌， 表达了姜育恒对人生的感受和信念。 …… 花开又花落 日子怎么这么不好过 这无心的错 苦尝结果也算走过 生命的活 快乐挫折都是活 我的歌 我的说 我的活 这首歌唱得很有感情，尤其在唱到“日子怎么这么不好过”时，听来格 外让人动容。可能这也和姜育恒的经历有关吧。据说，这张专辑面市后，姜 育恒的女儿曾经在接受记者采访时说：“你们千万不要盗我爸爸的唱片，不 然我爸就没钱为我交学费了。”可是他的唱片又怎么会不被盗版呢？想听他 的歌的人中有多少买得起正版？而买得起正版唱片的人中又有多少愿意听他 的歌？ 我虽然爱听姜育恒的歌，可对他的经历知道的却很少，这则消息只是偶 然看来的，因为我对别人的生活、隐私等等不感兴趣。但从这消息里，可以 知道姜育恒的生活很困苦。我想，这是可能的。 从他的歌中，我可以推测，他这样的人在现实生活里未必能“位高而多 金”。因为得到“高位”的人多是岳不群一类的倜傥风流人物；而那些“多 金”者，也多是江玉郎一类特别有耐性的人。我猜姜育恒绝不是这两类人。 也许，我只是在猜想而已，但我喜欢这么猜想。我想，他或许宁愿“漂 泊”，“行走”，也不愿牺牲自己的个性，就像在“风凄凄意绵绵”中唱的 一样： 今天还在行走 没有目的的脚印 走过的痕迹 都是我的眼泪 码头的汽笛声 思念着我的旧情人 流浪者的漂泊 心中无恨 姜育恒的歌是唯美的，姜育恒的说是感人的，姜育恒的活是幸福的，愿 漂泊在歌里的姜育恒永远“心中无恨”。 2000．4．16 中午12：20写；2000．4．17 上午11：05录 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 17 00:08:19 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA27963 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:08:14 -0500 Received: (qmail 23906 invoked by uid 108); 17 Apr 2000 07:06:30 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18762 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 07:05:18 -0000 Received: from web217.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.117) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 07:05:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 17422 invoked by uid 60001); 17 Apr 2000 07:04:34 -0000 Message-ID: <20000417070434.17421.qmail@web217.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [140.174.105.34] by web217.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:04:34 PDT Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 00:04:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Ying Subject: Re: [xys_friends] About jiangyuheng To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 68 - http://www.xys.org 曾经也狠买过一阵他的CD，最近看到这张新的，没敢下手， 怕失望，现在看来可以一试。 伊可 --- jccb4 wrote: > - http://www.xys.org > > > 漂 泊 的 流 浪 者 心 中 无 恨 > > ——听姜育恒的最新专辑CD《女人的选择》 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 17 00:23:48 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA28018 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 02:23:48 -0500 Received: (qmail 9653 invoked by uid 108); 17 Apr 2000 07:22:03 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27173 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2000 07:21:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 17 Apr 2000 07:21:22 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id PAA08244 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:19:14 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 19 Apr 1999 07:44:29 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA11830 for ; Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:16:42 +0800 Message-ID: <000801bfa83d$2f2fdac0$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000417070434.17421.qmail@web217.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] About jiangyuheng Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:18:51 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 69 - http://www.xys.org > 曾经也狠买过一阵他的CD，最近看到这张新的，没敢下手， > 怕失望，现在看来可以一试。 > > 伊可 :你要千万小心！各人的口味不同！如果你觉得上当，千万别找我算帐:-) 不过，我觉得，除了标题曲，别的歌都很有“姜”味。第一首几乎全是 念白，只唱了几句，还是用韩文唱的，我听来是很有韵味；当然，没有 一首歌相跟往事干杯结尾那句听来那么过瘾，但整张唱片的深沉和味道， 却是很好，甚至可以说最好的，所以里面几乎都是韩国歌曲。其中有一 首老歌“泪的小花”，无数人唱过，我硬盘里还有一首青山唱的mp3， 可你一听就知道，姜育恒的唱法就是和别人不同，深沉到了极点。这张 唱片的配器很简单，几乎只有吉他，钢琴，大小提琴，别的乐器很少有。 对了，我买的是盗版，才十元钱一张。就是想买正版，我也没地方买:-) 肖毛 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 17 22:55:50 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA00981 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:55:49 -0500 Received: (qmail 22580 invoked by uid 108); 18 Apr 2000 06:13:57 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 16092 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2000 05:52:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 18 Apr 2000 05:52:54 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id NAA09240 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:40:07 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 20 Apr 1999 06:05:23 UT Received: from jccb4 ([10.1.18.26]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA3129 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:37:35 +0800 Message-ID: <00db01bfa8f8$8030c9a0$1a12010a@jccb4> From: "jccb4" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000417070434.17421.qmail@web217.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: [xys_friends] jianpan Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:39:43 +0800 Organization: hec X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 70 - http://www.xys.org 临 死 前 的 回 忆 不骗你，真的，我刚生下来时，也像那个曾来过这间办公室里的 税务局的处长那样又白又胖——这词有些用得不对了，我并不胖，我 从来就没有胖过，但我的确曾白过，就象经济犯也有过不贪污的清白 从前一样。 唉，说起过去，真叫人伤感。我曾经是多么，多么……的呵，可 现在却人老珠黄，像个要咽气的黑包公一样躺在这个大纸盒子里，等 谁来把我处理掉。不过，现在的我心里却很平静，甚至还有些快乐。 人死之前，据说爱回忆过去；要被处理前的我，此刻也想起了我的过 去……让我快点回忆我吧，估计我没多少时间了。 我还记得我刚到这间办公室的时候。那时，屋内的那几个男女总 是轮番坐在我面前，一边拍打着我，一边若有所思地望着前方的那个 方方的彩色大黑板。 其中，最爱我的是个长发的女人，她也是我的第一任主人。（她 的舌头也很长，有时那里面的口水会流到我脸上，弄得我痒痒的。） 每次，只要一坐到我身边，她就会深情地凝视我半天，才伸出她的一 只胖手指（那上面还套着小圈子呢）和我打着哑语。我呢，则默默地 和她交流，为她把回答写在那块黑板上。 一般，她都最先摸我的三个部位，我那三个部位就心领神会地在 那黑板上写出相应的感受： “FOX”。然后她又按了一下我中间偏右 的地方，于是黑板上就显示了这样的字：“FOXBASE”。 接着，她又 摸我的另三个部位，黑板上就出现了这三个字母：USE…… 几乎每次都是这样。聪明的我从此就记住她了。只要有人能通过 我在黑板上写出“FOX…USE”等的字样，那么，那个人就是最爱我的人。 可惜，人无完人。她虽然最爱我，却总是把我弄得湿了吧唧的， 因为只要她一坐到我跟前，就不停地和屋里的人说话。（准确的地说， 只要在这屋子里，她就一直在说话。这里的所有人都这样，因为她们 有嘴。）她说的那些话特别深奥。语速又很快，因此我记不住多少， 如今只能回忆起这样几个词：孩子，那个没良心的，长工资，贱货， 主任你好潇洒，下流，减肥，离婚，退休等。虽然我记得不全，但她 （还有她们）每天说的主要内容大致也就这些了。当然，有时这些话 的排列顺序不同，不然岂不是显得太单调了吗？ 在她谈话时，那些酸酸的小水珠就不断地往我脸上掉，有时还真 让我受不了。 大约一年后，她不再出现了，不知去了哪里。那时，我面前的黑 板好像坏了，我也被换到了办公室里的另一个角落，面对着一块更大， 更艳丽的黑板。我还看见了一个新邻居，他说他叫老鼠。我估计这是 个外号，如同有人叫阿Q， 有人叫总统一样，因为我怎么看他都不像 老鼠，连胡子都没长。 我的第二任主人是一个年轻的男人。他很奇怪，一般很难听见他 说话，我怀疑他可能没有嘴，或者嘴出了毛病。有空他就坐在我面前， 总是不怀好意地在我身上摸来摸去，当然，有时也摸摸那只老鼠。只 是，他却几乎看都不看我一眼，真叫我伤心。他还有个特点，常喜欢 摸我最左边的一个部位（那上面写着三个字母：Esc）， 尤其在我听 见有人说“主任来了”的时候。然后，我就看见他在黑板上写出这样 的话，也不知道是什么意思：“Go to hell”。 为什么他老看那黑板，却不看我？有一次，我好奇的望向黑板， 见上面写着：“Resume”。这是什么意思？我不知道。一周以后，他 也消失了，听屋里人说，是去“赚大钱”去了。这个词，我也不知道 是什么意思。我一向诚实，从来没有过不懂装懂的时候，不然，我早 就去竞选总统了，至少也能做个高级教授。 他走后，我才发现我已经变成了黑人。要知道，我已经一年半没 有洗澡了。要是我能自己洗澡的话，我一定……算了，有人天天洗澡， 里外还都是一团黑呢，命运是不可抗拒的，我何必强求？ 又过了一年。这一年中，我几乎完全被冷落了。虽然也有不同的 人坐在我面前，可她们却基本不看我，也不理我。因为她们有了什么“windows95”，所以 就只摸老鼠，很少摸我了。 我现在特别的痛恨 老鼠，也恨人类——那些人情谊绵绵的用手握着老鼠的样子，我一看 就恶心。当然，偶尔也有人拍拍我，但那只是偶尔罢了。 大约又过了半年，某日，我搬到主任的办公室里去了，因为住在 他房里的我的一位同伴死掉了，那个主任想让我陪他几天。（临走前， 我听屋里人嘀咕什么“主任那里能上网”，不知是什么意思。）这没 什么，我可是很乐于助人的，何况是“助主任”？可是，我却发现我 不太喜欢他，因为他一坐在我面前，就让那黑板变得花花绿绿的，格 外地刺我眼睛。我曾经偷看了一下，发现那黑板上方总是有“某某网 站”的字样，中间多是一些彩色的图片，看起来很是新鲜。那天，大 概是无意识的，他摸了我上下交错相邻的三个部位，于是黑板上就显 出了这三个字母：“SEX”。 等了一会儿，一些图片就出现在黑板上了，我定睛一看，忍不住 脸红了：都是些什么不堪入目的图片呀！用我第一任女主人的话来讲， 这些东西就叫“下贱”吧？别看了，快摸我最上边的写着 “Esc”的 那个部位！我情不自禁地大喊起来——这才意识到，原来我根本就不 会说人话。 何况，这时的他根本就不理我，只是搂着老鼠，一副卿卿我我的 样子，口水流得我满脸都是。真恶心！我更讨厌人类了。 还好，三天后，主任的屋里又来了一位代替我的同伴。他一见我， 便问我是不是从埃塞俄比亚来的。我很生气地告诉他：用不了多久， 你会比我黑八倍！我们早晚都要变黑——可是我宁愿再黑八倍，我不 愿看这个流口水的大胖子。 我很高兴我又能回到原来的那间办公室。但是，那些人却还是对 老鼠情有独钟，偶尔才会碰我。好在我已经习惯了这种寂寞了。 闲着的时候，我就和黑板上的邻居谈天。不过，那些邻居多数流 动得很快，只除了一个叫“金山词霸”的，一天到晚总在那里。时间 一长，我就和他混熟了。他可真是博学，什么都懂。我曾问他：你名 字的前两个字为什么叫“金山”？你和金山有什么关系吗？金山词霸 听罢，朝我神秘地笑笑，说：“没什么关系啦。我是盗版的。” 什么叫盗版？我没有再问。因为我对这个词不感兴趣，虽然听了 很多回了。还有一次，我对他谈起我的第一任女主人，还说她喜欢在 黑板上写“FOX…USE”这几个字母。金山词霸对字母特别感兴趣，听 我说完就来了兴致：这是什么意思？我给你查查。几秒钟后，他得意 地告诉我：OK很好不错，这是个词组，意思是——狐狸使用。金山词 霸真了不起，连这也知道。我记得我的那个女主人有时曾小声说过“ 狐狸精”什么的，当时我还不懂，现在可以知道，这个词大概是她自 己的外号。 “Go to hell”是什么意思？我忽然又想起了我的第二个主人。 “见鬼去吧！”金山词霸回答。 “你干嘛骂我？”我不高兴了。“老外，”金山词霸不屑地说， “你问我的那几个词就是这个意思！” 原来如此。那么“Resume”呢？ 金山词霸想了想，忍不住笑起来： “写这个词的人和写Go to hell的人是同一个人吗？” “你怎么知道的？”我好奇地问。 “这就对了。这个人现在一定不在了。能同时写这两个词的人一般 都辞职了。” “你还是告诉我Resume是什么意思吧？”我不耐烦了。 “哎呀，就是‘简历’的意思。真笨！” 那么，“SEX”呢？我问。金山词霸犹豫了一下，说：“你最好别问 这个，对这种事人们的习惯是只做不说的，尤其是有身份的人，更是如此。” 不问就不问，懂的知识多有什么了不起？还不是一样天天在黑板的 右下角挂着？从此，我懒得去理金山词霸了。有一天，他消失了。听说 他有了“病毒”，被“卸载”了。活该，这就是有知识的下场：早晚要 被“卸载”！ 可是，我不能总和邻居谈天。我有时更喜欢安静。但是，屋里总是 那么吵，像有三十只苍蝇在三十个方向飞来飞去的样子。我不想再听这 些噪音，我也不想再忍受那些口水了。我活够了。 我开始厌世了。我不再在乎是否有人在意我了，即使有人摸我，我 也几乎没有反应了。 我麻木了。 长话短说。昨天，我终于退休了，因为不管别人摸我什么地方，我 都一点反应都没有，也不肯在黑板上写字了。其实我是懒得去写而已。 可她们却说我“坏了”，就把我装到了墙角的那个大纸盒子里。屋里的 人彻底不理会我了，但我不伤心。反正我也受够了，这无止无尽的谈话 和口水，谁能受得了？还不如退休，或者死亡呢！这就是现实，谁都有 这一天，我能接受这现实，我能上能下。 据说，今天会有什么“修理工”把我带走，如果“修理”不好我， 就把我当垃圾扔掉。是呀，有了老鼠，主任，还有谈话，口水什么的， 生活就皆大欢喜了，我又算什么呢——这么老，这么黑，这么不识时务？ 你看，那不是吗？有一个陌生人正朝我这边走过来了。他一定就是 “修理工”。他拿起我看了看，说：“这东西没有修理的价值了，扔掉 吧！” 在我被扔掉之前，我得说一下我叫什么，以便你能记得我。不然， 一会就来不及了。 再见了，朋友，记住，我叫键盘——我猜你早知道我的名字了…… 2000．4．17 夜9：05肖毛写；2000．4．18 下午13：00录入 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 18 21:15:45 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA06934 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:15:44 -0500 Received: (qmail 7694 invoked by uid 108); 18 Apr 2000 23:46:59 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 2293 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2000 23:44:39 -0000 Received: from web1102.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.23.122) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 18 Apr 2000 23:44:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 19194 invoked by uid 60001); 18 Apr 2000 23:44:35 -0000 Message-ID: <20000418234435.19193.qmail@web1102.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [192.9.25.22] by web1102.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:44:35 PDT Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:44:35 -0700 (PDT) From: "R. Zhang" Subject: Re: [xys_friends] jianpan To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 71 - http://www.xys.org > > 2000．4．17 夜9：05肖毛写；2000．4．18 > 下午13：00录入 Did you have somebody else type for you after you wrote it?:-) Ron __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 19 06:46:23 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA08732 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:46:23 -0500 Received: (qmail 25961 invoked by uid 7797); 19 Apr 2000 13:51:23 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 5822 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2000 13:43:10 -0000 Received: from f173.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.173) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 19 Apr 2000 13:43:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 72504 invoked by uid 0); 19 Apr 2000 13:42:25 -0000 Message-ID: <20000419134225.72503.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.196.171.12 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:42:25 PDT X-Originating-IP: [38.196.171.12] From: "Jun Xia" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:42:25 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 72 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 这次回来见到了泥、一华和南郭。网上网下还是不一样的，所以有机会大家应该多见 见。最近网上好象没有看到泥。 无论是香港、新加坡还是韩国，都可以看到《新语丝》，就是大陆看不到。网友的 损失太大。 回去看了一个朋友的网站，不妨推荐一下：www.cfi.net.cn 总算了解了国内网站是如何运行的。 泽熙 >From: Shi-min Fang >Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" >To: xys_friends@listbot.com >Subject: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ >Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:06:54 -0700 > > - http://www.xys.org > >自前天起Yahoo!改换界面后，就一直要我交信用卡 >验证年龄，真是莫名其妙。我改用hotmail.com了。 > >这是我进入以后显示的。我记得清清楚楚我是填的 >真生日，而且就算填错了，也不能说让我用了一年 >多了，才来提苛刻要求吧。别人有没这种情况？ >Please get your parent's >permission soon to avoid >interruptions with account >access. > > >But, I am an adult. >Verify your age by credit card. > >Why does Yahoo! think I'm a child? >Perhaps you signed up with a child's birthdate. > > >______________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com >Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/links/joinlb From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 19 07:02:43 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA08888 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:02:42 -0500 Received: (qmail 27633 invoked by uid 0); 19 Apr 2000 14:08:44 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26555 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2000 13:56:58 -0000 Received: from f237.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.237) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 19 Apr 2000 13:56:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 80399 invoked by uid 0); 19 Apr 2000 13:56:53 -0000 Message-ID: <20000419135653.80398.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 202.104.86.90 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:56:53 PDT X-Originating-IP: [202.104.86.90] From: "minghy minghy" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:56:53 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 73 - http://www.xys.org >这次回来见到了泥、一华和南郭。网上网下还是不一样的，所以有机会大家应该多见 >见。最近网上好象没有看到泥。 > >无论是香港、新加坡还是韩国，都可以看到《新语丝》，就是大陆看不到。网友的 >损失太大。 （赶紧跳出来：）---- 我在我在，最近在做思想检讨呢：），胡说八道的次数太多了。 现在老去新浪的影视论坛，同龄人比较多。都和我一样嘴无遮掩 说话一点责任都不负：）。 推荐一个“才女”的网页：http://www.nease.net/~sunsun 其中新片传真御法度写的很不错，我是顶佩服的。 泥 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 19 15:44:26 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA11889 for ; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:44:26 -0500 Received: (qmail 27020 invoked by uid 108); 19 Apr 2000 16:10:36 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 21103 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2000 16:08:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep4.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.77) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 19 Apr 2000 16:08:19 -0000 Received: from default ([202.109.49.76]) by fep4.online.sh.cn (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with SMTP id <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default>; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:06:58 +0800 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 0:7:57 +0800 From: Zhou Yihua To: "webzine@tdkt.org" CC: "xys_friends@listbot.com" Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: X-mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [en] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 74 - http://www.xys.org 欢迎泽熙兄回来！这次你上海之行最大的损失是什么？知道不？ 那就是没趁我绍兴老酒喝到晕乎乎时递上四宝请我即兴泼上两 首诗：） 泽熙声称不喜欢吃腌的东西，结果却被我骗到咸亨酒店，偏让 他吃鳗鲞、黄泥螺、霉千张烧肉，尤其是霉千张端上来就臭气 腾腾，怎一个腌字了得：）熏得泽熙酒兴大发，喝了一壶又一 壶：）来时他就说由他请客，点酒时他挑贵的点，什么60多块 一瓶的黄酒。我及时劝阻了他，告诉他那不是咱乙己兄喝的， 应该要大坛子装的酒，在绍兴的咸亨是用碗喝的。这种大坛酒 虽便宜，但非常好喝，舀在一把酒壶里端上来，美中不足的是 让我们使玻璃杯喝。那天点的清蒸黄鱼很不错。 一华 At 00-4-18 10:00:00, you wrote: >好啊！一华诗兴大发，南郭兄又有倒卖，好像没有见到泥。 > >在上海吃了回香豆，绍兴菜，的确很有特点。就象韩国泡菜一样， >别处还找不到。同时也见识了一华兄的酒量。 > >回来就一个吃字，但吃了什么也不记得，乱吃一气，但都比这里 >吃得好，比什么唐人街上的菜也强得多。 > >在美国总是去吃那个7美元的自助餐，4年下来也吃得腻了。只有 >两次例外，就是在辛城的两家意大利餐馆，和朋友俩个人，一次 >花了八十多，一次花了七十多(加小费)。那里的服务生训练有素， >十分诙谐。我就象看戏一样。 > >韩国的服务生老给人鞠躬，我有时也不禁学着弯下腰。深圳的服 >务生质量大长，但太多了，门口一大排，饭桌旁后面、右边各站 >一个。弄得有些不自在。 > >广州人开车见缝插针，弄得我心惊肉跳。武汉人、香港人也都如 >此。上海的交通大有改进，但那个隧道收费太高，来回30，我一 >天至少二、三个来回。相对来讲，新加坡交通要好一些，但司机 >个个都是不谈政治的政治家，长套长套地发表自己的见解。 > >看到的太多，以后慢慢说。 > >泽熙 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 19 23:56:29 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA14207 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:56:28 -0500 Received: (qmail 27643 invoked by uid 108); 19 Apr 2000 20:11:13 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12981 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2000 20:13:24 -0000 Received: from f117.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.117) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 19 Apr 2000 20:13:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 3642 invoked by uid 0); 19 Apr 2000 20:07:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20000419200756.3641.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.196.171.12 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:07:56 PDT X-Originating-IP: [38.196.171.12] From: "Jun Xia" To: webzine@tdkt.org Cc: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:07:56 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 75 - http://www.xys.org 只知道一华兄会赏诗，不知道会作诗，损失太大。我住的那家酒店故作高雅，在墙壁 上题了一首什么“古诗”。我和几个老同学读了半天也不知所以，结果一华兄一到， 立马破解，原来是酒店拼装错了。本打算去投诉，大家谈得兴起，也就把这事给忘 了。 泽熙 >From: Zhou Yihua >Reply-To: Zhou Yihua >To: "webzine@tdkt.org" >CC: "xys_friends@listbot.com" >Subject: Re: Re: >Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 0:7:57 +0800 > >欢迎泽熙兄回来！这次你上海之行最大的损失是什么？知道不？ >那就是没趁我绍兴老酒喝到晕乎乎时递上四宝请我即兴泼上两 >首诗：） > >泽熙声称不喜欢吃腌的东西，结果却被我骗到咸亨酒店，偏让 >他吃鳗鲞、黄泥螺、霉千张烧肉，尤其是霉千张端上来就臭气 >腾腾，怎一个腌字了得：）熏得泽熙酒兴大发，喝了一壶又一 >壶：）来时他就说由他请客，点酒时他挑贵的点，什么60多块 >一瓶的黄酒。我及时劝阻了他，告诉他那不是咱乙己兄喝的， >应该要大坛子装的酒，在绍兴的咸亨是用碗喝的。这种大坛酒 >虽便宜，但非常好喝，舀在一把酒壶里端上来，美中不足的是 >让我们使玻璃杯喝。那天点的清蒸黄鱼很不错。 > >一华 > >At 00-4-18 10:00:00, you wrote: > >好啊！一华诗兴大发，南郭兄又有倒卖，好像没有见到泥。 > > > >在上海吃了回香豆，绍兴菜，的确很有特点。就象韩国泡菜一样， > >别处还找不到。同时也见识了一华兄的酒量。 > > > >回来就一个吃字，但吃了什么也不记得，乱吃一气，但都比这里 > >吃得好，比什么唐人街上的菜也强得多。 > > > >在美国总是去吃那个7美元的自助餐，4年下来也吃得腻了。只有 > >两次例外，就是在辛城的两家意大利餐馆，和朋友俩个人，一次 > >花了八十多，一次花了七十多(加小费)。那里的服务生训练有素， > >十分诙谐。我就象看戏一样。 > > > >韩国的服务生老给人鞠躬，我有时也不禁学着弯下腰。深圳的服 > >务生质量大长，但太多了，门口一大排，饭桌旁后面、右边各站 > >一个。弄得有些不自在。 > > > >广州人开车见缝插针，弄得我心惊肉跳。武汉人、香港人也都如 > >此。上海的交通大有改进，但那个隧道收费太高，来回30，我一 > >天至少二、三个来回。相对来讲，新加坡交通要好一些，但司机 > >个个都是不谈政治的政治家，长套长套地发表自己的见解。 > > > >看到的太多，以后慢慢说。 > > > >泽熙 > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 00:08:12 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA14306 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:08:11 -0500 Received: (qmail 9185 invoked by uid 7797); 20 Apr 2000 07:13:32 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 7015 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 07:05:46 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 07:05:46 -0000 Received: from default (putc12161208206.cts.com [216.120.8.206]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA99716 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:04:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000420000043.0084eb10@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: smfang@pop.mail.yahoo.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:00:43 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 无意中成了吃专利的发明家:-) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 76 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 当初把我克隆出基因的那个蛋白质拿去申请专利时，也 没想过要赚什么钱。今天突然从研究所收到半年来的专 利分成，数目还不小，够我大半年的生活费了。搞了八 年的分子生物学研究，总算有了一个美丽的结局。呵呵。 方舟子 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 01:10:25 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail14.listbot.com ([204.71.191.208]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA14635 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:10:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 18004 invoked by uid 7797); 20 Apr 2000 08:15:36 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 25316 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 08:08:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 08:08:19 -0000 Received: from p2 [203.93.95.211] by mail.qdcatv.com.cn [203.93.95.10] with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.0.2.R) for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:00:30 +0800 Message-ID: <000701bfaa9f$15430920$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <3.0.6.32.20000420000043.0084eb10@pop.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 无意中成了吃专利的发明家:-) Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:04:40 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn X-MDRcpt-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-MDRemoteIP: 203.93.95.211 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 77 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org 恭喜恭喜。手里恐怕不止这一项专利吧？说不定以后还能有意外的收获。 你的yahoo信箱有能用了？ ----- Original Message ----- From: Shi-min Fang To: Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 3:00 PM Subject: [xys_friends] 无意中成了吃专利的发明家:-) > Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org > > > 当初把我克隆出基因的那个蛋白质拿去申请专利时，也 > 没想过要赚什么钱。今天突然从研究所收到半年来的专 > 利分成，数目还不小，够我大半年的生活费了。搞了八 > 年的分子生物学研究，总算有了一个美丽的结局。呵呵。 > > 方舟子 > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Advertisement: > Workstation with Monitor under $800! > So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by > the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes > everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. > http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 > ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 05:29:17 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA15390 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:29:17 -0500 Received: (qmail 7258 invoked by uid 108); 20 Apr 2000 12:27:29 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 28216 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 12:31:10 -0000 Received: from ha1.rdc2.on.home.com (HELO mail.rdc2.on.home.com) (24.9.0.15) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 12:31:10 -0000 Received: from home.com ([24.64.145.247]) by mail.rdc2.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with ESMTP id <20000420122539.CNRC12247.mail.rdc2.on.home.com@home.com> for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 05:25:39 -0700 Message-ID: <38FEF70D.22F8163C@home.com> Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 08:24:46 -0400 From: Sam Woole Organization: @Home Network X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-AtHome0407 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,zh-CN,zh-TW MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] =?iso-8859-1?Q?=CE=DE=D2=E2=D6=D0=B3=C9=C1=CB=B3=D4=D7=A8=C0=FB=B5=C4=B7=A2=C3=F7=BC=D2?=: -) References: <3.0.6.32.20000420000043.0084eb10@pop.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 78 - http://www.xys.org Congratulations to Shi-min Fang !!! Sam ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 09:07:44 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA16357 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:07:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 15092 invoked by uid 108); 20 Apr 2000 16:05:51 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 4774 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 15:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep2.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.75) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 15:56:28 -0000 Received: from default ([202.109.86.54]) by fep2.online.sh.cn (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with SMTP id <20000420155524.EWIV20969.fep2.online.sh.cn@default>; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:55:24 +0800 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:56:20 +0800 From: Zhou Yihua To: "xys_friends@listbot.com" CC: "webzine@tdkt.org" Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: Re: X-mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [en] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20000420155524.EWIV20969.fep2.online.sh.cn@default> Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 79 - http://www.xys.org At 00-4-19 13:07:00, you wrote: > >只知道一华兄会赏诗，不知道会作诗，损失太大。我住的那家酒店故作高雅，在墙壁 >上题了一首什么“古诗”。我和几个老同学读了半天也不知所以，结果一华兄一到， >立马破解，原来是酒店拼装错了。本打算去投诉，大家谈得兴起，也就把这事给忘 >了。 > >泽熙 > 不好意思，那天怎么也想不起来是谁的诗，回来一查是王湾 的。 一华 　　　次北固山下 　　　　王湾 客路青山外，行舟绿水前。 潮平两岸阔，风正一帆悬。 海日生残夜，江春入旧年。 乡书何处达？归雁洛阳边。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 12:31:35 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA17282 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:31:34 -0500 Received: (qmail 16208 invoked by uid 108); 20 Apr 2000 08:23:06 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 13062 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 08:13:15 -0000 Received: from web204.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.104) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 08:13:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 9062 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Apr 2000 08:12:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20000420081207.9061.qmail@web204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.8.206] by web204.mail.yahoo.com; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:12:07 PDT Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:12:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 无意中成了吃专利的发明家:-) To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 80 - http://www.xys.org --- Ding Ye wrote: >恭喜恭喜。手里恐怕不止这一项专利吧？说不定以后还能有意外的收获。 > 没了，就这项了，福无双至嘛。 分子生物学开始资本化了，还在搞分子生物学的人还是 很有赚钱前途的。 > 你的yahoo信箱有能用了？ > 用是能用，就是每次进去都要被警告填写信用卡验明 身份，否则马上就会不能用。我是多用一天算一天 吧。 刚申请了hotmail，没想到这两天它都不收国内的信。 是不是有国内的人在跟它捣鬼？ 方舟子 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 13:27:45 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA17537 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:27:44 -0500 Received: (qmail 17508 invoked by uid 108); 20 Apr 2000 08:54:18 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 5571 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 08:51:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep3.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.76) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 08:51:56 -0000 Received: from surf ([202.109.41.9]) by fep3.online.sh.cn (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with SMTP id <20000420085002.DSVO5897.fep3.online.sh.cn@surf> for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:50:02 +0800 Message-ID: <000001bfaaa5$77116e20$de64a8c0@surf> From: "翔宇" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419134225.72503.qmail@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:49:26 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 81 - http://www.xys.org ----- Original Message ----- From: Jun Xia To: Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 9:42 PM Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Yahoo!在干什么？ > Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org > > 这次回来见到了泥、一华和南郭。网上网下还是不一样的，所以有机会大家应该多见 > 见。最近网上好象没有看到泥。 > > 无论是香港、新加坡还是韩国，都可以看到《新语丝》，就是大陆看不到。网友的 > 损失太大。 > 实际可以避免这个损失，用“方教主”推荐的方法： 用代理服务器： http://proxy.spaceproxy.com/-_-http://www.xys.org/ 即可 翔宇 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 20 17:35:12 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA18412 for ; Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:35:12 -0500 Received: (qmail 6805 invoked by uid 108); 20 Apr 2000 11:39:27 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 25498 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 11:41:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mutt.freemail.ne.jp) (210.235.164.41) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 11:41:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 6101 invoked by alias); 20 Apr 2000 20:36:00 +0900 Received: (qmail 2750 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2000 13:03:18 +0900 Received: from peko.canotec.co.jp (HELO mail) (202.228.180.193) by 210.235.164.41 with SMTP; 20 Apr 2000 13:03:18 +0900 Message-ID: <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> From: "freemail" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> Subject: [xys_friends] the upsidedown face of coins Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:01:58 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 82 - http://www.xys.org > > 欢迎泽熙兄回来！这次你上海之行最大的损失是什么？知道不？ > > 一华 > > At 00-4-18 10:00:00, you wrote: > >好啊！一华诗兴大发，南郭兄又有倒卖，好像没有见到泥。 > >泽熙 鄙人字生日,一直对比较文明,特别是比较具体的差异模式感兴趣.文明与模式 有极大关 系. 中文的文章不太看,但是泽熙先生的文明比较文章可是每篇不漏的. 一直有个问题,问了包括美国的文学教授,还没得到满意的解答. 东方的硬币是正反面左右旋转对称的,而西方的硬币则是正反面上下旋转对称的. (请原谅使用了不是常用词语的造语正反面左右/上下旋转对称.因为没有现成的.) 就是说我们看惯了的,觉得只有一种模式的人民币的硬币(包括日本,亚洲以及一些欧洲 等国家的硬币), 在欧美人看来,是反的,是不美观甚至是难看的.反之亦然,在东方人看来,美元等欧美硬 币是反的,是不美观 甚至是难看的.文明的冲突并不是很停顿的书出版后才有的. 那么这种截然相反的本质性的审美模式的内在心理差异,以及正反面左右/上下旋转对称 差异的起源是什么呢? 当然我自己有了自己的解释,但是还不满意.希望听到对比较文明下功夫较多的泽熙先生 与诸位喜欢考据先生们 的意见. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 22 05:21:09 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA26376 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 07:21:04 -0500 Received: (qmail 14281 invoked by uid 108); 21 Apr 2000 12:02:36 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27519 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2000 12:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mutt.freemail.ne.jp) (210.235.164.41) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 21 Apr 2000 12:05:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 19860 invoked by alias); 21 Apr 2000 20:59:51 +0900 Received: (qmail 17922 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2000 16:48:27 +0900 Received: from peko.canotec.co.jp (HELO mail) (202.228.180.193) by 210.235.164.41 with SMTP; 21 Apr 2000 16:48:27 +0900 Message-ID: <004c01bfab65$db445b80$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> From: "freemail" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000420081207.9061.qmail@web204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: [xys_friends] =?hz-gb-2312?B?UmU6fntOXlJiVlAzSUFLM1RXKEB7NUQ3IkN3PFJ+fTotKQ==?= Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:29:03 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="hz-gb-2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 83 - http://www.xys.org > > >~{9'O29'O2!#JV@o?VEB2;V9UbR;OnW(@{0I#?K52;6(RT:s;9D\SPRbMb5DJU;q!#~} > > > > ~{C;AK#,>MUbOnAK#,8#N^K+VABo!#~} > ~{7VWSIzNoQ'?*J;/AK#,;9TZ8c7VWSIzNoQ'5DHK;9JG~} > ~{:\SPW,G.G0M>5D!#~} ~{9'O2~}! ~{QP>?=xPPOBH%;9JG;aSPIjGkW(@{<[V55D3I9{5D~}. ~{Hg9{;(>+A&W"RbJ2C4QP>?;aSPILR5<[V55D;0~},~{SPILR58P>u5D;0~},~{;9;aSPOBR;8v5D~}. ~{SPAKILR58P>u~},~{HCQ'Iz~},~{QP>?U_TZVP9zWvJ5Qi~},~{HCVP9z5D~}??~{?*7"GxM6WJ~},~{2zF7MbOz~} ~{E7C@~},~{R2?IRTN*VP9z@O0YPUWv91OW~}. ~{NR5DR;8v8c7VWSIzNoQ'5DVP9zHKQP>?U_TZHU1>QP>?@%3f7V@`~},~{SC7VWSIzNoQ'5D3I9{~} ~{V$CwHU1>5D0e?i7V@kSk5XVJQ'5D=a9{SPO`M,R2SPO`Rl~},~{?FQP3I9{IOAK~} ~{3/HUPBNE~} ~{5DO&?/M7Lu~}.~{?FQP3I9{TZVxC{1(?/5DM70fM7LuIO1(5@JG:\DQ5DJBGi~}.~{C{SPAK~},~{@{;9C;5=~}. ~{2%VV;z~}@~{Ub<8LlSP5cOP?U~} ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 22 06:40:56 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA26655 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:40:56 -0500 Received: (qmail 29806 invoked by uid 108); 21 Apr 2000 13:25:59 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 7114 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2000 13:25:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 21 Apr 2000 13:25:10 -0000 Received: from p2 [203.93.95.211] by mail.qdcatv.com.cn [203.93.95.10] with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.0.2.R) for ; Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:16:36 +0800 Message-ID: <000701bfab93$f80ff200$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:17:38 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn X-MDRcpt-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-MDRemoteIP: 203.93.95.211 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 84 - http://www.xys.org hello 今天才看了泽熙兄的《经典悖论》，有些问题提出来大家讨论一下，也活跃一下最近寺 里的气氛。 有些悖论是可以通过科学给予比较满意的解释的。比方说那个“先有鸡还是先有蛋”的 经典悖论，泽熙兄也说了，用考古和生物学可以作出解释。最近读了些生物科普的文 章，我自己作出了个解释，舟子看看对不对。 正如泽熙兄所说的“它里面也隐含着一个不相容的前提假设：‘鸡是由蛋孵化出来的， 蛋又是由鸡生出来的。’”但是这个假设虽然在日常生活中成立，但是引入进化论并不 是总成立，因为生物的后代会变异。所以引入进化论之后，就可以有个解释。首先明确 一下鸡和鸡蛋的定义，（改变鸡和鸡蛋的定义，我们可以得到不同的结论。）我们先固 定鸡的定义，就是在生物学上所有符合鸡的生物特征的动物。而鸡蛋的定义如果是能孵 出鸡的卵的话，那么就是先有鸡蛋再有鸡。这样解释，有一只鸡的雌性祖先（已经十分 接近鸡，也是卵生动物）受精的时候，受精卵发生变异，这个卵孵出的是符合鸡的生物 特征的动物。于是这个卵就是鸡蛋了。而如果鸡蛋的定义是鸡产下的卵的话，自然是现 有鸡后有鸡蛋。 另外就是那个“射出的箭永远都飞不出去”。泽熙兄说这个悖论用微积分来解释，我有 些不明白。事实上，我在学微积分的时候就知道了这个悖论，我当时试过，但是发现用 微积分来解释实际上是在循环论证。或许，这跟我学的高数的程度有关。我是学工的， 念的是二类高数，对于微积分的理论基础论述不多，以至于实际上我对于微积分一直都 不明白，只是会用而已，哪位老兄或许真能用微积分给解释一下？我觉得这个悖论涉及 的实际是运动的本质，就是箭到底是如何飞出第一步的问题，芝诺认为物体的运动是连 续的，所以无限分割运动路程就会导致箭根本射不出去。运动如果在空间上是断续的 话，就不能把箭射出的路程无限地分下去，也就不会有这个悖论了。在我的印象里，好 象运动确实是断续的。（量子力学？不好意思，物理学地也不深，不敢肯定） 我觉得出现悖论是因为人的思维方式存在问题。如果拿计算机和人脑进行类比的话，实 际上思维方式就好象计算机的程序，我们的思维方式实际是存在bug的。把本来有限的 事物当成无限来看待就是个bug。 另外还有一些似乎构不成悖论。像：“老子的：‘知者不言，言者不知。’是一条悖 论，被白居易一语道穿。白居易在《读老子》里说道：‘言者不知知者默，此语吾闻于 老君。若道老君是知者，缘何自着五千文？’”如果老子说自己是知者自然构成悖论， 不过我想着老子可从来没说过自己是知者。他只不过是在描绘自己理想中的知者而已。 再就是像很多禅宗的语录，禅宗的思考方式跟西方哲学有极大的不同，更多时候在用比 喻之类的说法，不应该用逻辑来批判。 --一叶 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 22 19:54:37 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA29168 for ; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:54:37 -0500 Received: (qmail 1021 invoked by uid 108); 22 Apr 2000 21:29:10 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 15353 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2000 21:06:15 -0000 Received: from f245.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.245) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 22 Apr 2000 21:06:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 60200 invoked by uid 0); 22 Apr 2000 21:06:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20000422210610.60199.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 129.137.228.188 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:06:10 PDT X-Originating-IP: [129.137.228.188] From: "Jun Xia" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:06:10 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 85 - http://www.xys.org >今天才看了泽熙兄的《经典悖论》，有些问题提出来大家讨论一下，也活跃一下最近寺 >里的气氛。 一叶兄，有些问题我也说不上来，就请网上的专家来回答吧。 这就说说资料来源及其我的取舍。 >有些悖论是可以通过科学给予比较满意的解释的。比方说那个"先有鸡还是先有蛋"的 >经典悖论，泽熙兄也说了，用考古和生物学可以作出解释。最近读了些生物科普的文 >章，我自己作出了个解释，舟子看看对不对。 > >正如泽熙兄所说的"它里面也隐含着一个不相容的前提假设：'鸡是由蛋孵化出来的， >蛋又是由鸡生出来的。'"但是这个假设虽然在日常生活中成立，但是引入进化论并不 >是总成立，因为生物的后代会变异。所以引入进化论之后，就可以有个解释。首先明确 >一下鸡和鸡蛋的定义，（改变鸡和鸡蛋的定义，我们可以得到不同的结论。）我们先固 >定鸡的定义，就是在生物学上所有符合鸡的生物特征的动物。而鸡蛋的定义如果是能孵 >出鸡的卵的话，那么就是先有鸡蛋再有鸡。这样解释，有一只鸡的雌性祖先（已经十分 >接近鸡，也是卵生动物）受精的时候，受精卵发生变异，这个卵孵出的是符合鸡的生物 >特征的动物。于是这个卵就是鸡蛋了。而如果鸡蛋的定义是鸡产下的卵的话，自然是现 >有鸡后有鸡蛋。 这是两个方面： 从形式上讲是逻辑问题，这是一个“无穷倒退”，就象镜子 照镜子，可以无限地倒退回去。 从内容上讲是生物学问题，构不成悖论，有先有后。舟子是 专家，就请舟子来评判吧。 >另外就是那个"射出的箭永远都飞不出去"。泽熙兄说这个悖论用微积分来解释，我有 >些不明白。事实上，我在学微积分的时候就知道了这个悖论，我当时试过，但是发现用 >微积分来解释实际上是在循环论证。或许，这跟我学的高数的程度有关。我是学工的， >念的是二类高数，对于微积分的理论基础论述不多，以至于实际上我对于微积分一直都 >不明白，只是会用而已，哪位老兄或许真能用微积分给解释一下？我觉得这个悖论涉及 >的实际是运动的本质，就是箭到底是如何飞出第一步的问题，芝诺认为物体的运动是连 >续的，所以无限分割运动路程就会导致箭根本射不出去。运动如果在空间上是断续的 >话，就不能把箭射出的路程无限地分下去，也就不会有这个悖论了。在我的印象里，好 >象运动确实是断续的。（量子力学？不好意思，物理学地也不深，不敢肯定） 回答这个问题有三个角度： 一是哲学角度：运动是(时间和空间)不间断性和(时间和空 间)不间断性的统一。这里使用了辩证法，但我觉得仍然抽 象，所以没有袭用这一说法。 二是从物理学角度：这里有一段话选自《宇宙透视》柯峭 榕著(注：由于文章全面否定相对论和辩证法，而我对其中 的“现代物理学”部分不了解，所以也没有贸然引用，下 面“解答”亦请专家评判)： 第二节 运动之实质 　　好，让至今还统治着科学理论界的“相对论”靠 边站着吧！让我们认真地去了解一下物质运动的本质 过程━━即回答本章开端处所提的问题：物质在空间 基元中是如何推进的？为何在空间基元里的推进不必 再经过渐进的过程？ (略) 　　因此，所有物质的运动皆包含着相互交替的两个 过程，其一是即刻扩张推进的过程；其二是停顿自我 循环包括即刻收缩的过程！！而推进的进程由于是一 种即刻扩充、不经过渐进的过程，所以与速度无关！！ 总而言之，物质的内部循环变化是连续的，但其运动 却是不连续的！！！ 　　物质运动之实质过程我们终于弄清楚了！于是， 那有关物质运动的千古哲学难题━━即所谓的“芝诺 疑难”（有人称之“芝诺悖论”），终于可以得到彻 底的解决了━━ 　　古希腊哲学家芝诺提出了“两段法”、“阿基里 斯追不上龟”、“飞矢不动”等一些疑难。这些问题 到如今其实皆还没有得到过真正清晰明确的回答！这 些难题其实正是有关时空基元与物质运动过程的问 题！ 　　“两段法”认为：由于任何两点之间还有着无限 多个点，而物体是不可能走完无限个点的，因此物体 无法从一点运动到任何的另一点！ 　　可是现在，我们知道空间有着最小的极限单元（即 存在着空间基元）；于是空间是不能够被无限分割的， 任何两点之间都不会有着无限多个点！因此，“两段 法”的前提便已是错误的，因而“两段法”纯属谬论！ “阿基里斯追不上龟”这个悖论更是著名。这个 问题与物质运动的过程有关，其内容为：阿基里斯虽 然是行走如飞的“神行太保”，但是他却永远也追不 上前面极慢爬行着的乌龟！其道理是：阿基里斯如果 要追上乌龟，那么他便要先到达乌龟刚才所在的位置， 可当他到达那位置，乌龟则当然已离开那位置而前进 了一小段距离。于是，如此重复下去虽然距离越来越 近但始终却都还有着距离。也就是说，阿基里斯先到 达前面乌龟所处的位置是追上它的前提，可是每当他 追赶到那位置，被追者又总已离开那位置而到了前面 的另一个新的位置。于是追赶者又要重复刚才的过程， 而这样重复地追赶下去乃是永无追上之时的━━可这 又是追赶者所必须经历的！所以，芝诺的结论便是“阿 基里斯永远也追不上龟”！ 　　芝诺的这个结论虽然与现实是格格不入的，可他 的推论却又是严密的。人们如果细细地去思考他所论 述的这个问题，便会真的觉得他说的不无道理！千百 年来，人们无法真正清楚地指出这悖论究竟错在哪里！ 于是，有的人干脆认为“运动就是存在着的矛盾本身”。 可是，如此将不能解决的矛盾归于矛盾、归于天生自 然，能说是解决了矛盾吗？？ 　　现在，由于我们知道，物质运动的过程由相互交 替的两个环节所构成；这两个环节乃是物质的扩充式 即刻推进过程与物质停顿自我循环之过程！这就是说， 物质的运动皆是不连续的，皆是一走一停、一走一停 地进行着的！━━于是，芝诺这“千古疑难”的破解 便显得非常的简单：芝诺这悖论错就错在人们及他皆 以为运动是连续的，所以阿基里斯自然无法追得上乌 龟；而实际上，由于所有的运动皆是不连续的，因此 当阿基里斯追赶到离乌龟只隔一个空间基元的时候， 由于其速度大故停顿自我循环的时间远比乌龟要短， 结果在乌龟还在继续停顿作自我循环的时候，阿基里 斯便已追了上去，一下子便会触着了龟的尾巴，而后 同理便会赶上它、也可以超越它！！ 　　芝诺还有一个所谓的“飞矢不动”的悖论。就是 说，他认为“飞行的箭是静止不动的”。其道理是： 箭在飞行的某一时刻，必定是处在某一个位置上，它 不能同时占有两个位置；因此，箭在这一个时刻应当 是静止的。可是，箭在这一个时刻静止在这个位置上， 另一个时刻静止在别的位置上，于是整个过程皆由这 样一系列的静止来构成，而静止的总和是不能构成运 动的、静止的总和当然还是静止！所以说飞行的箭是 不动的！！ 　　━━虽然芝诺的这个结论本身便是一个矛盾，但 此悖论却将道理讲得头头是道。 　　至今，人们“最有力”的反驳则首推黑格尔的辩 证法，但是黑格尔不过是用矛盾来处理矛盾罢了！他 认为“运动的物体在某一时刻既在某一位置又不在这 个位置”。也就是说：在同一时刻，运动物体既在这 个地方又不在这个地方；既在这里又同时在那里！这， 显然也是矛盾的，所以黑格尔干脆就认为运动本身便 是矛盾！ ━━其实，如果说穿了，黑格尔这所谓的辩 证法在实质上与芝诺那“飞矢不动”之悖论乃一路的 货色是也！！ 　　不过，情有可原，芝诺与黑格尔肯定不是有意制 造悖论与矛盾，原因乃是他们不清楚物质运动之实质 过程。那么，现在由于我们知道，物质的运动乃是推 进与停顿交替进行着的；因此，我们可以清楚地描述 出飞行之箭的运作过程：概括地说，飞行之箭乃是推 进与停顿交替进行着一个过程！这推进是箭之所有的 成份基元之各循环体及中心体的极性密度转移循环导 致相应的空间基元“静空子”之中间体即刻转化为箭 身一部分的过程；而这停顿则是箭之所有的成份基元 每推进一个空间基元后便停顿进行自身存在所必须的 自我循环的过程！！当然，在这停顿的过程中，箭后 面的成份基元亦分离出本来所结合的空间基元之中间 体！ 　　总之，那飞行之箭与所有的运动之物一般，其运 动乃是断续地进行着的；那箭处在一系列位置上时是 静止的（不过，这静止只是整体推进的停顿，而在这 整体的内部却在不断地进行着存在过程所必须的自我 循环变化过程）；但箭在那系列位置里的每两个位置 之间则皆还有着一个即刻扩充推进的过程！！故“飞 矢不动”只不过是很碰巧地对箭之运动的过程刚好说 对了其中的一个片段！！ 　　━━看吧，芝诺的悖论其实乃是建立在人们对空 间、对物质运动的一些模糊直观的概念之上的。当我 们理解了空间的结构、了解了物质运动之实质及过程， 那些悖论的致命之处则便暴露无遗了！于是我们可以 宣布：芝诺悖论这千古疑难今朝已真相大白于天下 了！！ 三是从数学角度。从极限、微积分的角度，一般教科书和词 典是这么说的。如我看到的《第三次数学危机》、《不列颠 百科全书》等。但都没有给出证明。《不列颠百科全书》列 出了阿基里斯和神龟的两个极限式，两者之差还是极限式， 但没有解答，后面说涉及到极限。我跑到极限部分一看，又 从速度极限谈起，但没有涉及到这个悖论。我想其中一定有 严格的证明，在大一点的数学史里可能可以找到，所以我引 用了这个说法。我手边资料不足，还得请专家出马。 >我觉得出现悖论是因为人的思维方式存在问题。如果拿计算机和人脑进行类比的话，实 >际上思维方式就好象计算机的程序，我们的思维方式实际是存在bug的。把本来有限的 >事物当成无限来看待就是个bug。 > >另外还有一些似乎构不成悖论。像："老子的：'知者不言，言者不知。'是一条悖 >论，被白居易一语道穿。白居易在《读老子》里说道：'言者不知知者默，此语吾闻于 >老君。若道老君是知者，缘何自着五千文？'"如果老子说自己是知者自然构成悖论， >不过我想着老子可从来没说过自己是知者。他只不过是在描绘自己理想中的知者而已。 这涉及到悖论分类问题，争论很多。我在下面一章也涉及到。 关键是老子的言行不一。五千文是言，根据他的定义当属“不 知”。而实际上他是知的，那五千文就是证明。所以这是个悖 论。它类似於“勋章悖论”：给人颁发一块勋章，上面却写着： “禁止授勋”。自己的行为违背了自己的表述。 >再就是像很多禅宗的语录，禅宗的思考方式跟西方哲学有极大的不同，更多时候在用比 >喻之类的说法，不应该用逻辑来批判。 > >--一叶 用形式逻辑来揭示禅为悖论是从佛学家那里开始的。我的目的 也不在于“批评”，而在于比较。从这个角度看禅，我觉得也 清楚了许多。 泽熙 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 23 03:01:38 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA31089 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 05:01:38 -0500 Received: (qmail 23917 invoked by uid 108); 23 Apr 2000 10:00:03 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 20345 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2000 09:59:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.qdcatv.com.cn) (203.93.95.10) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 2000 09:59:08 -0000 Received: from p2 [203.93.95.249] by mail.qdcatv.com.cn [203.93.95.10] with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.0.2.R) for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 17:51:13 +0800 Message-ID: <000501bfad08$f6fd4400$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> From: "Ding Ye" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000422210610.60199.qmail@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 17:47:35 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-Return-Path: dingye@mail.qdcatv.com.cn X-MDRcpt-To: xys_friends@listbot.com X-MDRemoteIP: 203.93.95.249 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 86 - http://www.xys.org Hi, >从形式上讲是逻辑问题，这是一个“无穷倒退”，就象镜子 >照镜子，可以无限地倒退回去。 这也构不成“无穷倒退”，我觉得可以这样解释： 1。镜子反射的时候会吸收能量，早晚会因为光的能量被吸收 殆尽而无法产生像。 2。这样看也可以：镜子照镜子无限地倒退回去，镜子上成像 的面积需要无限小，而镜子要成像至少要是一个分子那么大 （具体不清楚，换成原子也无所谓），分子的大小不是无限 小，因此镜子照镜子无法无限地倒退。 这么说不是要抬杠，我只是想说，所谓“无穷倒退”之类人们 关于“无限”的概念，或许在实际中根本就不存在，人们有这 种概念，其实只是因为人们思维方式之一--归纳法存在的bug。 >这涉及到悖论分类问题，争论很多。我在下面一章也涉及到。 >关键是老子的言行不一。五千文是言，根据他的定义当属“不 >知”。而实际上他是知的，那五千文就是证明。所以这是个悖 >论。它类似於“勋章悖论”：给人颁发一块勋章，上面却写着： >“禁止授勋”。自己的行为违背了自己的表述。 >用形式逻辑来揭示禅为悖论是从佛学家那里开始的。我的目的 >也不在于“批评”，而在于比较。从这个角度看禅，我觉得也 >清楚了许多。 确实是种角度。但是给人的感觉就像把“欢乐颂”用音波振动的 函数来分析一样，有点风马牛不相及。老子的第一句话就是“道 可道也，非恒道也”，认为道是无法用言语来表达的。禅宗也是 这么认为，都有些神秘主义的味道。 --一叶 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 23 05:04:53 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA31312 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 07:04:53 -0500 Received: (qmail 21552 invoked by uid 108); 23 Apr 2000 12:03:18 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 8396 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2000 12:00:34 -0000 Received: from web216.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.68.116) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 2000 12:00:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 5674 invoked by uid 60001); 23 Apr 2000 11:58:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20000423115849.5673.qmail@web216.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.120.9.52] by web216.mail.yahoo.com; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:58:49 PDT Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 04:58:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 87 - http://www.xys.org 鸡－蛋问题，因为只是泛指蛋，而没有特指鸡蛋，所以 自然是先有蛋后有鸡，在有鸡之前，已有很多动物开始 下蛋了。 方舟子 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 23 06:13:27 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA31457 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 08:13:26 -0500 Received: (qmail 9693 invoked by uid 108); 23 Apr 2000 13:11:52 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 16880 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2000 13:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.hzic.edu.cn) (210.33.88.2) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 2000 13:10:39 -0000 Received: from hutuworm ([210.33.88.237]) by mail.hzic.edu.cn (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-12345L500S10000V35) with SMTP id cn for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 21:11:08 +0800 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 21:5:12 +0800 From: "hutuworm" To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B9=D8=D3=DA=D4=F3=CE=F5=D0=D6=B5=C4=BE=AD=B5=E4=E3=A3=C2=DB?= X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 2 [eg] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US_ASCII" Message-ID: <20000423131108015.AAA373@mail.hzic.edu.cn@hutuworm> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id IAA31457 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 88 - http://www.xys.org Hi, Shi-min Fang, 到底先有鸡蛋还是先有鸡呢？ //thinkhard 小糊涂虫 ----喜欢刨根问底.... xixi At 00-4-23 4:58:00 you wrote: > - http://www.xys.org > >鸡－蛋问题，因为只是泛指蛋，而没有特指鸡蛋，所以 >自然是先有蛋后有鸡，在有鸡之前，已有很多动物开始 >下蛋了。 > >方舟子 > ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 23 17:50:18 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA01176 for ; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:50:18 -0500 Received: (qmail 29519 invoked by uid 108); 23 Apr 2000 15:43:28 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 29006 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2000 15:41:20 -0000 Received: from law-f164.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.227) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 2000 15:41:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 4404 invoked by uid 0); 23 Apr 2000 15:40:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20000423154010.4403.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 132.236.102.153 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 23 Apr 2000 08:40:10 PDT X-Originating-IP: [132.236.102.153] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 15:40:10 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 89 - http://www.xys.org >鸡－蛋问题，因为只是泛指蛋，而没有特指鸡蛋，所以 >自然是先有蛋后有鸡，在有鸡之前，已有很多动物开始 >下蛋了。 记得很早以前看的一篇公刘的小说，说一个村妇如何 用自己的悉心照料(大概是把鸡蛋放在她自己的棉袄里 面)孵出了鸡，并说：一个困扰哲学家这么久的问题却 被一个村妇轻易地以事实解决和说明了：自然是先有蛋 后有鸡。:) 一笑。 应帆 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 05:55:45 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA03590 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 07:55:40 -0500 Received: (qmail 12870 invoked by uid 108); 24 Apr 2000 12:53:59 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 20078 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2000 12:53:04 -0000 Received: from oe2.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.240.106) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2000 12:53:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 16775 invoked by uid 65534); 24 Apr 2000 12:51:18 -0000 Message-ID: <20000424125118.16774.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [38.196.171.12] From: "Jun Xia" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] the upsidedown face of coins Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:45:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 90 - http://www.xys.org > 鄙人字生日,一直对比较文明,特别是比较具体的差异模式感兴趣.文明与模式 有极大 关 > 系. > > 中文的文章不太看,但是泽熙先生的文明比较文章可是每篇不漏的. > > 一直有个问题,问了包括美国的文学教授,还没得到满意的解答. > > 东方的硬币是正反面左右旋转对称的,而西方的硬币则是正反面上下旋转对称的. > > (请原谅使用了不是常用词语的造语正反面左右/上下旋转对称.因为没有现成的.) > > 就是说我们看惯了的,觉得只有一种模式的人民币的硬币(包括日本,亚洲以及一些欧 洲 > 等国家的硬币), > > 在欧美人看来,是反的,是不美观甚至是难看的.反之亦然,在东方人看来,美元等欧美 硬 > 币是反的,是不美观 > > 甚至是难看的.文明的冲突并不是很停顿的书出版后才有的. > > 那么这种截然相反的本质性的审美模式的内在心理差异,以及正反面左右/上下旋转对 称 > 差异的起源是什么呢? > > 当然我自己有了自己的解释,但是还不满意.希望听到对比较文明下功夫较多的泽熙先 生 > 与诸位喜欢考据先生们 > > 的意见. > 多谢先生鼓励。东西方文明确有不同，当然冲突在亨廷顿以前就有。不过从硬币旋转 探讨审美模式的内在心理差异，以及差异的起源，我没有思考过。先生既然有自己 的解释，能否拿出来让我们也了解、学习？ 泽熙 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 06:11:50 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA03704 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:11:50 -0500 Received: (qmail 7545 invoked by uid 108); 24 Apr 2000 13:09:54 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26232 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2000 13:13:53 -0000 Received: from ha1.rdc2.on.home.com (HELO mail.rdc2.on.home.com) (24.9.0.15) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2000 13:13:53 -0000 Received: from home.com ([24.64.145.247]) by mail.rdc2.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with ESMTP id <20000424130809.JANL12247.mail.rdc2.on.home.com@home.com> for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 06:08:09 -0700 Message-ID: <3904470A.47CF17D9@home.com> Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:07:25 -0400 From: Sam Woole Organization: @Home Network X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-AtHome0407 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,zh-CN,zh-TW MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] the upsidedown face of coins References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 91 - http://www.xys.org 加拿大硬，同于中国硬币，左右旋转得正相(对称)，上下旋转得倒相(不对称)。 加拿大计有六种硬币，皆如此。 Sam. freemail wrote: > > 一直有个问题,问了包括美国的文学教授,还没得到满意的解答. > > 东方的硬币是正反面左右旋转对称的,而西方的硬币则是正反面上下旋转对称的. > > (请原谅使用了不是常用词语的造语正反面左右/上下旋转对称.因为没有现成的.) > > 就是说我们看惯了的,觉得只有一种模式的人民币的硬币(包括日本,亚洲以及一些欧洲 > 等国家的硬币), > > 在欧美人看来,是反的,是不美观甚至是难看的.反之亦然,在东方人看来,美元等欧美硬 > 币是反的,是不美观 > > 甚至是难看的.文明的冲突并不是很停顿的书出版后才有的. > > 那么这种截然相反的本质性的审美模式的内在心理差异,以及正反面左右/上下旋转对称 > 差异的起源是什么呢? > > 当然我自己有了自己的解释,但是还不满意.希望听到对比较文明下功夫较多的泽熙先生 > 与诸位喜欢考据先生们 > > 的意见. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 17:41:29 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA07229 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:41:28 -0500 Received: (qmail 23641 invoked by uid 108); 25 Apr 2000 00:39:32 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27223 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 00:38:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.hzic.edu.cn) (210.33.88.2) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 00:38:46 -0000 Received: from hutuworm ([61.130.70.133]) by mail.hzic.edu.cn (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-12345L500S10000V35) with SMTP id cn for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:40:57 +0800 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 8:34:47 +0800 From: "hutuworm" To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re:Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B9=D8=D3=DA=D4=F3=CE=F5=D0=D6=B5=C4=BE=AD=B5=E4=E3=A3=C2=DB?= X-mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 2 [eg] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US_ASCII" Message-ID: <20000425004057953.AAA434@mail.hzic.edu.cn@hutuworm> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id TAA07229 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 92 - http://www.xys.org Hi, Shi-min Fang, At 00-4-23 23:41:00 you wrote: >> Hi, Shi-min Fang, >> >> 到底先有鸡蛋还是先有鸡呢？ //thinkhard >> > >那得看你怎么定义鸡蛋，是能孵出鸡的蛋（先有蛋） >还是鸡下的蛋（先有鸡）？ > 您老人家又把皮球踢回来了......呵呵 算俺没问。 ;) 小糊涂虫 ---- 冥思苦想...... ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 13:36:33 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA06184 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:36:33 -0500 Received: (qmail 17214 invoked by uid 108); 24 Apr 2000 06:43:11 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 19349 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2000 06:42:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO xys.xys.org) (207.152.99.201) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2000 06:42:30 -0000 Received: from xys.org (IDENT:fang@xys.org [207.152.99.201]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA02630 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:41:57 -0500 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:41:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Shi-min Fang To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B9=D8=D3=DA=D4=F3=CE=F5=D0=D6=B5=C4=BE=AD=B5=E4=E3=A3=C2=DB?= In-Reply-To: <20000423131108015.AAA373@mail.hzic.edu.cn@hutuworm> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 93 - http://www.xys.org On Sun, 23 Apr 2000, hutuworm wrote: > Hi, Shi-min Fang, > > 到底先有鸡蛋还是先有鸡呢？ //thinkhard > 那得看你怎么定义鸡蛋，是能孵出鸡的蛋（先有蛋） 还是鸡下的蛋（先有鸡）？ 方舟子 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 19:56:11 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA07985 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:56:11 -0500 Received: (qmail 20047 invoked by uid 109); 25 Apr 2000 03:02:15 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 23318 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 02:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mutt.freemail.ne.jp) (210.235.164.41) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 02:52:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 1503 invoked by alias); 25 Apr 2000 11:52:01 +0900 Received: (qmail 1485 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 11:52:00 +0900 Received: from peko.canotec.co.jp (HELO mail) (202.228.180.193) by 210.235.164.41 with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 11:52:00 +0900 Message-ID: <004601bfae61$1ca1f4e0$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> From: "freemail" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> <20000424125118.16774.qmail@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [xys_friends] the upsidedown face of coins Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:47:53 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 94 - http://www.xys.org > > 加拿大硬，同于中国硬币，左右旋转得正相(对称)，上下旋转得倒相(不对称)。 > 加拿大计有六种硬币，皆如此。 > Sam. 谢谢介绍.猜一猜,估计是 1/100, 5/100, 25/100, 50/100, 100/100, 200/100 请介绍面额. > > > > 一直有个问题,问了包括美国的文学教授,还没得到满意的解答. > > > > 东方的硬币是正反面左右旋转对称的,而西方的硬币则是正反面上下旋转对称的. > > > > 多谢先生鼓励。东西方文明确有不同，当然冲突在亨廷顿以前就有。不过从硬币旋转 > 探讨审美模式的内在心理差异，以及差异的起源，我没有思考过。先生既然有自己 > 的解释，能否拿出来让我们也了解、学习？ > > 泽熙 可能不对,不全面.我以为是受文字的横竖排列的影响.书籍的文字排列.可以解释 一部分.中国是作出硬币最早的国家,那时的文字书写是由上至下,竖排的. 西方的硬币可能最早出现在波斯,中东.在那里,文字是自左至右横排的. 硬币上面一定印有文字,所以遵守书籍的文字排列规则.可是在实用物品上, 特别是方形的物品,正反面上下旋转对称的东西不符合审美习惯,不太存在, 所以虽然有的国家的文字是横排的,但是硬币还是采用象物品一样的正反面左 右旋转对称的构造.这样的解释还是不满意. 比如解释开元通宝的月牙痕,据说是杨贵妃在蜡制模型上玉指一掐而由来. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Mon Apr 24 20:48:53 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA08292 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:48:52 -0500 Received: (qmail 23192 invoked by uid 108); 25 Apr 2000 04:07:28 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 18940 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 03:46:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mutt.freemail.ne.jp) (210.235.164.41) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 03:46:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 27788 invoked by alias); 25 Apr 2000 12:44:54 +0900 Received: (qmail 27741 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 12:44:51 +0900 Received: from peko.canotec.co.jp (HELO mail) (202.228.180.193) by 210.235.164.41 with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 12:44:51 +0900 Message-ID: <00df01bfae68$7e25c6e0$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> From: "freemail" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Subject: [xys_friends] =?hz-gb-2312?B?IFJlOiBSZTogfns5WFNaVHNOdVBWNUQ+LTVkYyNCW359?= Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:43:31 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="hz-gb-2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 95 - http://www.xys.org > > > ~{5=5WOHSP<&50;9JGOHSP<&DX#?~} > > ~{MbPP5D03JTR;JT~}.~{OHSP<&~}. ?~{TZ=x;/3IN*<&5D9}3LVP~},~{;7>3WwSCSZ<&~}, ~{6x2;JGWwSCSZ50~}.~{WwN*<&5DR;Iz1HWwN*505DJ135D<&5DJ135D505DJ1 Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.18]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA08400 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:02:55 -0500 Received: (qmail 67169 invoked by uid 0); 23 Apr 2000 22:23:43 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 28065 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2000 05:16:20 -0000 Received: from mail.ttlc.net (208.130.9.4) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2000 05:16:20 -0000 Received: from msp [206.151.172.25] by mail.ttlc.net (SMTPD32-6.00) id A99389C00152; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:20:19 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.20000424011912.007c9100@mail.ttlc.net> X-Sender: yige@mail.ttlc.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:19:12 -0700 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: yige Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 关于泽熙兄的经典悖论 In-Reply-To: <20000423154010.4403.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 96 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org >记得很早以前看的一篇公刘的小说，说一个村妇如何 >用自己的悉心照料(大概是把鸡蛋放在她自己的棉袄里 >面)孵出了鸡，并说：一个困扰哲学家这么久的问题却 >被一个村妇轻易地以事实解决和说明了：自然是先有蛋 >后有鸡。:) 一笑。 就那么容易么？记得今年的哪本贺岁片上有个笑话： 一只母鸡下了个蛋后，被公鸡到处追着啄。人家问 为什么，葛优答道：因为那母鸡下的是个鸭蛋。 原来是被一只老公鸭偷偷扣了顶绿帽子，怪不得大公鸡 要恼羞成怒。所以，由此看来，对于这个先有鸡还是先 有蛋的问题还有待于进一步探讨：－） ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 04:37:34 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail3.listbot.com ([204.71.191.36]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA10092 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 06:37:33 -0500 Received: (qmail 10322 invoked by uid 108); 25 Apr 2000 11:35:47 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 19169 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 11:34:56 -0000 Received: from ha1.rdc2.on.home.com (HELO mail.rdc2.on.home.com) (24.9.0.15) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 11:34:56 -0000 Received: from home.com ([24.64.145.247]) by mail.rdc2.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with ESMTP id <20000425113345.PIIP12247.mail.rdc2.on.home.com@home.com> for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:33:45 -0700 Message-ID: <3905826D.3FCAA396@home.com> Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 07:33:02 -0400 From: Sam Woole Organization: @Home Network X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-AtHome0407 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,zh-CN,zh-TW MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Subject: Re: [xys_friends] the upsidedown face of coins References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> <20000424125118.16774.qmail@hotmail.com> <004601bfae61$1ca1f4e0$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 97 - http://www.xys.org freemail wrote: > > 谢谢介绍.猜一猜,估计是 1/100, 5/100, 25/100, 50/100, 100/100, 200/100 > 请介绍面额. 加拿大六种硬币面额。无50/100。而系10/100。其馀五种同上。 Sam ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 17:30:13 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA13932 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:30:12 -0500 Received: (qmail 5780 invoked by uid 109); 26 Apr 2000 00:36:16 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 27370 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 00:26:18 -0000 Received: from law-f206.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.130.116) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 00:26:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 73496 invoked by uid 0); 26 Apr 2000 00:26:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20000426002613.73495.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 132.236.102.184 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:26:13 PDT X-Originating-IP: [132.236.102.184] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 不媚不煽的阿待 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:26:13 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 98 - http://www.xys.org 骗人家报纸稿费的文章，:)。 　　　　　　　　　不媚不煽的阿待 　　　　　　　　　　　　　应　帆 　　在自己才编完的《新语丝》２０００年４月刊上用了阿待最新的小说《水 强的水枪》，一个在美国挣扎的中国人的故事。而阿待一如既往，以她特有的 不媚不煽的行文风格让自己又一次饱尝了阅读的乐趣。 　　从某种意义上讲，阿待的小说可以说是网络文学的“另类”──如果非要 把它们归类为网络文学的话，那只能说是因为她的大多数作品都是在网络文学 杂志《新语丝》上首发的，而她作品的文字和内容跟所谓网络特征却很少沾边。 阿待从９７年起在新语丝推出她的中篇和短篇小说，三年间，创作的数量和质 量在同类体裁中都是出类拔萃的。 　　读阿待的小说，首先总是为其中的一些特有的“小说元素”的东西所迷惑 所吸引：有时是类似诗歌中意象的东西，比如《乌鸦》中不时出现的或狗或鱼 的“乌鸦”，《猫眼石》里面有时是眼睛有时是古董的“猫眼石”，《影子》 里面的影子肖像和手枪，《古玩》中那本很脏很黄的古代性事秘籍，《最后的 生日礼物》里胡敏的肚皮舞衣装；有时又是一些可称为巧合与神秘却又让人不 由不信的小说情节，就象《儿子》中魏光的小儿子坠楼身亡是因为追逐私生于 乡下的大儿子带来的破旧尼帽，《路杀》中神秘的吉普赛算卦老妇被曾经向她 问卜的中国男子路杀，《枪惑》中女主人公几次自杀未遂及最终获得精神上的 新生……这些生命中看似偶然有时又是必然的元素被作者巧妙地引进到小说创 作中来，让人读罢之际忍不住要追思、遐想和感叹。 　　阿待小说中的人物也变化多姿，构成一幅形形色色的逼真画廊，他们从男 到女，从中国人到美国人，从文革时期的青少年到当今时代的中青年……这些 不同的人物相逢相知，理解挣扎，编绎出一幕又一幕的故事，例如《圣诞前夜 的星空》中的在美国长大的中国男孩和爱慕母亲的美国男子之间的情感冲突， 《拉兹之歌》里教中文的中国女人和印度男子微妙的感情呼应，《儿子》里公 司总经理魏光和他在农村的私生子之间的两次邂逅，《亨德小姐》中的中国年 轻学子在保守的美国小镇见闻的各色人等，包括那貌女实男的同性恋者亨德小 姐……这些人物的年龄身份地位各各有异，所处的地域时域则又每每不同，但 是阿待的文字却让他们都又真实可信，并以此营造了小说引人入胜的故事背景。 　　总体来看阿待小说，还会感叹她表现出来的形形式式的创作风格：首先是 第一人称和第三人称的叙事主体在不同小说中的灵活运用，其次再如《处女塔》 里面以死者的身份来叙述往事；《路杀》中表现出来的微微的魔幻现实；《儿 子》中的纷繁世事间神秘而复杂的相似与联系；《艳遇》里面做过乳腺癌切割 手术的朱梅和美国无腿男子之间的艳遇真相和《饕鸦》里中国男留学生和美国 妇人同去饕餮野鸭美味的诙谐结局，则都有明显的欧·亨利式的出乎意料…… 可以说阿待的叙述风格跟她的小说人物形象、故事情节一样，绝少重复和雷同， 而在这种不重复不雷同之中，阿待凸现出一个属于她自己的风格和文体特征。 　　概括来说，我个人认为阿待的小说最大的特征就是不媚俗不煽情，这一点 却是当前许多网络文学乃至传统文学中的大弊病。阿待小说的场景、人物、情 节都含有某种独特性，出乎意料却又合乎情理，同时情节流畅，叙事冷静深刻， 即便偶尔温情（如《最后的生日礼物》中中国媳妇给濒死的美国公公表演了一 次肚皮舞）或者激情（如《我的太阳》中瞎眼的父亲和具有音乐天赋的儿子互 相为对方做出的巨大牺牲），但是绝不滥情、煽情，表现出深厚的功底和成熟 的创作态度。 　　如果非要说阿待的小说有什么不好的地方的话，那就是她的语言显得太过 中规中矩，相对而言缺乏个人色彩；另外也就是故事的不媚不煽了：有时候阅 读的兴趣是建立在读者能产生共鸣的基础上的，而阿待的大多数小说在维持个 体尊严和塑造独特故事情节的同时，也失去了和大多数读者贴近和共鸣的机会。 目前看到的也只是她的中短篇小说，这样的篇幅虽然比较符合网上阅读的兴趣， 但是要真正以某一篇作品的深度和广度赢得读者瞩目的话，大概还是要有长篇 小说的容量和内容才行的。 　　我们期待着阿待…… 注：本文提到的阿待小说作品可以在《新语丝》９７年到现在的期刊中找到。 《新语丝》电子月刊：http://www.xys.org/issues.html 阿待的部分小说：http://www.xys.org/xys/netters/adai/index.html 　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　２０００年４月１６日 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 17:32:02 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA13963 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:32:01 -0500 Received: (qmail 3979 invoked by uid 108); 26 Apr 2000 00:50:41 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 28444 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 00:28:15 -0000 Received: from law-f106.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.169) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 00:28:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 22161 invoked by uid 0); 26 Apr 2000 00:28:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20000426002810.22160.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 132.236.102.184 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:28:10 PDT X-Originating-IP: [132.236.102.184] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 诗三首 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:28:10 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 99 - http://www.xys.org 十 年 十年的青春已过 我们居然还可以假想 邂逅或是聚会 你的名字 如今竟是那城市的名字 而在我的心城 谁是唯一的永久居民 山峦如何升降 河流怎样变迁 我们如何相爱 又怎样在微笑的人群里 微笑而别 春 夜 据说今夜我们就要远行 江南已经有杏花烟雨 在等着 在故乡的春夜里等你 等你在人群里忽然抬头 那夜 月光如何穿透 梧桐树初生的枝叶 你的笑容如何穿透我年轻的心 是玄武还是太湖 是你还是我 为什么我记住的却只是你 在春夜熙攘人群中的 偶然回头 传 奇 河流分岔 在相思遗失的地方 相思遗失 在夏日的运河之畔 在十里蝉鸣十里浓绿 青山之外犹是青山 道路之后还是道路 狂热而来的你 黯然而去的你 在桌子的两端微笑着举杯 今天 所有的城市 由一根根缆线相连 是不是就象所有的情感 用一根根人类的神经联结 而我 在复杂的网线里 难进难退 2000.3.6 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 20:52:38 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA15015 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:52:38 -0500 Received: (qmail 28322 invoked by uid 108); 26 Apr 2000 03:50:38 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 860 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 03:43:07 -0000 Received: from law-f37.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.131.100) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 03:43:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 56467 invoked by uid 0); 26 Apr 2000 03:41:19 -0000 Message-ID: <20000426034119.56466.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.84.137.98 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:41:19 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.84.137.98] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: [xys_friends] 不媚不煽的阿待 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:41:19 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 100 - http://www.xys.org 早先发的居然是初稿。：( 　　　　　　　不媚不煽的阿待 　　　　　　　　　　　　　应　帆 　　在自己才编完的《新语丝》２０００年４月刊上用了阿待最新的小说《水 强的水枪》，一个在美国挣扎的中国人的故事。这个叫水强的中国人，因为不 满于他打工所在的中餐馆老板诱骗新来的大陆姑娘而义愤填膺，用自己收集的 玩具水枪威胁老板之际引来警察，警察以为他持的是真枪而将水强击毙……阿 待一如既往，以她特有充满小说元素的故事情节和不媚不煽的行文风格让我又 一次饱尝了阅读的乐趣。 　　从某种意义上讲，阿待的小说可以说是网络文学的“另类”──如果非要 把它们归类为网络文学的话，那只能说是因为她的大多数作品都是在网络文学 杂志《新语丝》上首发的，而她作品的文字和内容跟所谓网络特征却很少沾边。 阿待从９７年起在新语丝推出她的中篇和短篇小说，三年间，创作的数量和质 量在同类体裁中都是出类拔萃的。 　　读阿待的小说，首先总是会为其中的一些特有的“小说元素”的东西所迷 惑所吸引：有时是类似诗歌中意象的东西，比如《乌鸦》中名字都叫“乌鸦” 的黑狗和黑金鱼，《猫眼石》里面有时是眼睛有时是古董的“猫眼石”，《影 子》里面的影子肖像和手枪，《古玩》中那本很脏很黄的古代性事秘籍，《最 后的生日礼物》里胡敏的肚皮舞衣装……其次最吸引人的就是那些可称为巧合 与神秘却又让人不由不信的小说情节，这些小说情节充满神秘的宿命哲学色彩， 却绝非哗众取宠的离奇编造。象《儿子》中，魏光在乡下和山妹所生的大儿子 寻父未遇，留下的一顶尼帽却导致了小儿子的坠楼身亡；《路杀》中神秘的吉 卜赛算卦老妇预测黄畅会路杀一只很大的东西并不会和杰妮弗长久，最后黄畅 却路杀了这个醉酒的老妇并最终因此在生活中另起一行；《枪惑》中女主人公 几次自杀未遂及最终获得精神上的新生……这些生命中看似偶然有时又是必然 的元素被作者巧妙地引进到小说创作中来，让人读罢之际忍不住要追思、遐想 和感叹。 　　阿待的小说人物也变化多姿，构成立体多面的人物画廊。这些不同的人物 在阿待的笔下相逢相知，理解挣扎，演绎出一幕又一幕的故事。例如《圣诞前 夜的星空》中的在美国长大的中国男孩和爱慕母亲的美国男子之间的情感冲突， 《拉兹之歌》里教中文的中国女人和印度男子微妙的感情呼应，《儿子》里公 司总经理魏光在现今城市里的家庭事业和他在文革时期农村的情感遭遇，《亨 德小姐》中的中国年轻学子在保守的美国小镇见闻的各色人等，包括那假充按 摩女的男同性恋者亨德小姐……这些人物的年龄身份地位各各有异，所处的地 域时域则又每每不同，但是阿待的文字却让他们都又真实可信，并以此营造了 小说引人入胜的故事背景。 　　总体来看阿待小说，还会感叹她表现出来的形形式式的创作风格，可以说 每一篇小说都会让我们感受到不同以往的地方。人称的运用上，无论男女老少 中外城乡，阿待的第一人称和第三人称的叙事主体都准确到位，在《处女塔》 以死者的身份来叙述往事更与众有别。《路杀》中微微的魔幻现实主义和《影 子》中隐隐的哲学思辨，让人在故事之外体会更多。《艳遇》里面做过乳腺癌 切割手术的朱梅和美国无腿男子之间的艳遇真相和《饕鸭》里中国男留学生和 美国妇人同去饕餮野鸭美味的诙谐结局，则都有些欧·亨利小说的风格……可 以说阿待的叙述风格跟她的小说人物形象、故事情节一样，绝少重复和雷同， 而在这种不重复不雷同之中，阿待凸现出一个属于她自己的风格和文体特征。 　　也许，阿待小说最大的特征就是不媚俗不煽情，而这一点却正是她的小说 有别于当前许多网络文学乃至传统文学并强烈吸引了我的地方。她每篇小说的 场景、人物、情节都含有某种独特性，出乎意料却又合乎情理，同时情节流畅， 叙事冷静深刻，即便偶尔温情（如《最后的生日礼物》中中国媳妇给濒死的美 国公公表演肚皮舞）或者激情（如《我的太阳》中瞎眼的父亲和具有音乐天赋 的儿子互相为对方做出的巨大牺牲），但是绝不滥情、煽情、矫情，表现出深 厚的文学功底和成熟的创作态度。 　　如果非要说阿待的小说有什么不好的地方的话，那就是她的语言显得太过 中规中矩，相对而言缺乏个人色彩。另外，也就是故事的不媚不煽了：有时候 阅读的兴趣是建立在读者能产生共鸣的基础上的，而阿待的大多数小说在维持 个体尊严和塑造独特故事情节的同时，也失去了和大多数读者贴近和共鸣的机 会。目前看到的也只是她的中短篇小说，这样的篇幅虽然比较符合网上阅读的 兴趣，但是要真正以某一篇作品的深度和广度赢得读者瞩目的话，大概还是要 有长篇小说的容量和内容才行的。 　　阿待，总会让有所期“待”的读者们饱尝阅读乐趣并继续期待下去的。 注：本文提到的阿待小说作品可以在《新语丝》９７年到现在的期刊中找到。 《新语丝》电子月刊：http://www.xys.org/issues.html 阿待的部分小说：http://www.xys.org/pages2/adai.html 　　 　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　２０００年４月１７日 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 22:15:04 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA15399 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:15:04 -0500 Received: (qmail 1082 invoked by uid 108); 25 Apr 2000 07:35:18 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 3729 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 07:32:54 -0000 Received: from public.bta.net.cn (202.96.0.97) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 07:32:54 -0000 Received: from xiaolan (bt-209-057.bta.net.cn [202.106.209.57]) by public.bta.net.cn (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA21501 for ; Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:29:25 +0800 (GMT) Message-ID: <000801bfb01a$c32ce1c0$39d16aca@xiaolan> From: "Yu_He_Zhi" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> <20000424125118.16774.qmail@hotmail.com> <004601bfae61$1ca1f4e0$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?v6rUqs2osabHrg==?= Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:32:08 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 101 - http://www.xys.org > 比如解释开元通宝的月牙痕,据说是杨贵妃在蜡制模型上玉指一掐而由来. 《钱录》卷八： “右唐高祖开元通宝钱。按《旧唐书》，高祖即位仍用隋五铢钱，武德四年七月废 五铢钱，行开元通宝钱。给事中欧阳询制词及书。其字含八分及隶体，其词先上後下次 左後右读之，自上及左回环读之亦通，流俗谓之开通元宝钱。 “......以上凡七种，旧谱统谓之甲文钱。《谈宾录》云：初进蜡样日，文德皇后 掐一甲迹，故钱上有掐文。李孝美曰：此钱元字次画端或有挑向左者，世谓之左挑，俗 甚爱重，背文亦有两甲痕者。今按新、旧唐书并云置钱监于洛并幽益等州，又赐秦王齐 王三炉，右仆射裴寂一炉以铸，又五年五月又於桂州置监，则此背文各种，意铸钱者私 为标识以别之耳，不尽如前人所云也。” 庾荷芝 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Tue Apr 25 23:46:02 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail7.listbot.com ([204.71.191.5]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA15734 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:46:02 -0500 Received: (qmail 1127 invoked by uid 108); 25 Apr 2000 11:51:41 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 23942 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2000 11:45:31 -0000 Received: from oe17.law8.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.240.121) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 25 Apr 2000 11:45:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 69806 invoked by uid 65534); 25 Apr 2000 11:44:43 -0000 Message-ID: <20000425114443.69805.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [38.196.171.12] From: "Jun Xia" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000422210610.60199.qmail@hotmail.com> <000501bfad08$f6fd4400$7101100a@qdcatv.com.cn> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?UmU6IFt4eXNfZnJpZW5kc10gudjT2tTzzvXQ1rXEvq215OOjwts=?= Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 07:38:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 102 - http://www.xys.org > > Hi, > > >从形式上讲是逻辑问题，这是一个“无穷倒退”，就象镜子 > >照镜子，可以无限地倒退回去。 > > 这也构不成“无穷倒退”，我觉得可以这样解释： > > 1。镜子反射的时候会吸收能量，早晚会因为光的能量被吸收 > 殆尽而无法产生像。 > > 2。这样看也可以：镜子照镜子无限地倒退回去，镜子上成像 > 的面积需要无限小，而镜子要成像至少要是一个分子那么大 > （具体不清楚，换成原子也无所谓），分子的大小不是无限 > 小，因此镜子照镜子无法无限地倒退。 > > 这么说不是要抬杠，我只是想说，所谓“无穷倒退”之类人们 > 关于“无限”的概念，或许在实际中根本就不存在，人们有这 > 种概念，其实只是因为人们思维方式之一--归纳法存在的bug。 我说的是思维的一个困境，你说的是实际的例子。在理论上无限 还是存在的，函数里就有条渐进线。 > >用形式逻辑来揭示禅为悖论是从佛学家那里开始的。我的目的 > >也不在于“批评”，而在于比较。从这个角度看禅，我觉得也 > >清楚了许多。 > > 确实是种角度。但是给人的感觉就像把“欢乐颂”用音波振动的 > 函数来分析一样，有点风马牛不相及。老子的第一句话就是“道 > 可道也，非恒道也”，认为道是无法用言语来表达的。禅宗也是 > 这么认为，都有些神秘主义的味道。 > > --一叶 > “道可道，非常道。”你说的“无法用言语来表达”可是“常道”？ 有些禅是可道的，中间有“常道”；这些禅有的还是悖论，因此这些 悖论中也是有“常道”的。为什么人们会从“音波振动”中感觉到 “欢乐颂”？ ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 26 02:52:58 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA16261 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:52:57 -0500 Received: (qmail 5775 invoked by uid 108); 24 Apr 2000 12:03:25 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 19500 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2000 12:00:24 -0000 Received: from mailbox4.cts.com (209.68.192.50) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2000 12:00:24 -0000 Received: from default (putc32161209179.cts.com [216.120.9.179]) by mailbox4.cts.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA43921 for ; Mon, 24 Apr 2000 04:59:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000424045533.0084f690@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: smfang@pop.mail.yahoo.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 04:55:33 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 别了，雅虎 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 103 - http://www.xys.org 原载《中国青年报》“数字青年”周刊2000.4.24。 “数字青年”可从以下网址取阅： http://www.cyd.com.cn/szqn/home/GB/default.htm 别了，雅虎 －－网站评点之三十一 ·方舟子· 去年我写过一篇《选一个免费电子信箱》，建议大家都选用一个所谓 “永久性”的免费电子邮箱，特别是国内的朋友，为保证通讯的顺畅，更 有这个必要。我当时建议大家从yahoo.com和hotmail.com中选一个，因为 它们隶属世界上数一数二的大公司，服务较有保障。“因为历史的原因”， 我自己用的是yahoo.com，但是我也指出yahoo.com有广告显示经常出问题 而产生网络错误、服务器不稳定、连接速度慢等特点，并希望以后他们能 够改进。从那以后它的服务并没有改进，这些问题都还存在，而且越发严 重。据说yahoo.com受到过黑客的攻击所以影响了速度，但我想这种攻击 总不该天天有的吧？而且近来yahoo.com跟国内的通讯一直不顺，国内寄来 的信常常收不到，我寄过去的信也被挡了回来。所以我一直就想换个信箱 了，但这个邮址朋友们已熟悉，更换起来太麻烦，就这么拖下去。最 近碰到的一件事，却促使我下定决心跟雅虎告别。 几天前yahoo.com对界面设计做了一点小改动，我登录以后，却出来 一页信息，说我是未成年人，以后要去获得父母的许可才能使用该信箱， 如果我是成年人，就请输入信用卡号、真实姓名和家庭住址验明正身。真 让我怀疑是误闯了成年网站。于是给其客户支持人写了封信反映。回信 称，这是因为我当初注册时填写了未成年的生日，如果有误，需要提供信 用卡号和个人的真实身份，才能改正。他们为了保护未成年人，需要对未 成年人上网有所限制，云云。 这种借口，是相当拙劣的。我不敢保证我当时填的出生月、日正确， 但我肯定填的是正确年份，因为从没想过要冒充未成年人。但是我没法去 查证我究竟填了什么样的生日了，因为在信箱个人档案中，生日这一条已 被隐去，据说是“为了安全起见”，实情如何，只有雅虎的人才知道了。 而且，把注册时填写的生日看得如此重要，是荒唐的。那个生日完全 是凭个人自觉填的。如果我是个未成年人，可以填个假生日冒充成年人， 雅虎又如何知道？如果我是个成年人而想冒充未成年人，也可以填个假生 日，然后再当其父母给予上网许可。 如果我果真填错了生日，被当成了未成年人，那么就应该一开始就要 我验明正身，而不能说让我不受限制地使用了一年多，我的朋友都熟悉了 这个邮址之后，才突然提出苛刻的要求。如果我不答应其要求，就会有不 少的麻烦。所以，这种做法，近于讹诈。 我给雅虎的客户支持人又写了封信，列了以上的理由，结果收到的回 信，和上次的一模一样，看来是机器自动生成的。看样子，他们是打定主 意非要我的信用卡和家庭住址不可了。他们信誓旦旦保证绝不会收费，对 此我也相信。如果我信不过他们，也可以选用一张不常用的信用卡，然后 注销就是了。但是我觉得他们的这种做法，是在变相地收集用户的个人资 料。对这种隐私，我本来也不在意，但是既然还有许多并不想侵犯我的隐 私的免费信箱服务，我又何必在一棵树上吊死呢？于是我就只好跟雅虎告 别，改用hotmail.com了（smfang@hotmail.com）。 或许有人会说：给你免费使用就很不错了，何必这么计较呢？其实免 费信箱并非真正免费的，用户是在通过广告显示的方式在交费。尤其是象 我这样每天要收发几十封、上百封来信的“大户”，为雅虎带去的广告收 入远远超过了交费信箱的费用。我们不应该把商业网站的“免费”服务当 成一种恩赐。对那些放长线钓大鱼、让你使用一段时间再突然提出苛刻要 求使你欲罢不能的公司更应该敬而远之，不要再跟它有任何的来往。他们 的这种做法也许并不违法，却破坏了用户的信任。 2000.4.18. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Wed Apr 26 14:05:23 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail7.listbot.com ([204.71.191.5]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA19257 for ; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:05:22 -0500 Received: (qmail 13573 invoked by uid 108); 26 Apr 2000 08:18:31 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 13450 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 08:20:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.112) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 08:20:48 -0000 Received: from public ([61.128.159.170]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FTM00AQ86TDZA@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:12:50 +0800 (CST) Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:19:51 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: [xys_friends] test and sent again To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FTM00AQ96TDZA@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id QAA19257 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 104 - http://www.xys.org 我发的帖子怎么个个都石沉大海？ ------------------------------------------- 从北京回来后，写了份北京汇报发上来，却一直见不着；本 想重发，家里的电脑却崩溃了，好不容易把WIN98重装上去， 但硬盘里的内容一洗而空。内里有好几篇写了一大半的文章。 呜呼。 说是呜呼，其实有点过分，我常常是开了头后就不知道怎么 往下写了，短期内也没有完成它们的计划。所以，大可安慰 自己，写不完挂在那里，还不如重头写呢。 今天早上，我的一个同事办公室里的机器也完蛋了，上天保 佑，最好能恢复，硬盘里那么多东西，又没备份。。。真是 恐怖。 4月26日，病毒爆发日。虽然反复查了几次，没有发现什么 病毒，我还是把电脑时间推后了一天。 螳螂 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 27 03:55:35 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail7.listbot.com ([204.71.191.5]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA22210 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 05:55:34 -0500 Received: (qmail 10434 invoked by uid 108); 26 Apr 2000 23:57:52 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 9429 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 23:54:53 -0000 Received: from law2-f266.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (216.32.180.224) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 23:54:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 99893 invoked by uid 0); 26 Apr 2000 23:54:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20000426235447.99892.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 152.166.83.220 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:54:47 PDT X-Originating-IP: [152.166.83.220] From: "si si" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 别了，雅虎 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:54:47 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 105 - http://www.xys.org 个人以为这是YAHOO在UPGRADE的时候产生的BUG。似乎不应该以偏盖全。 做为一个PORTAL SITE，YAHOO是很不错的。 不过，YAHOO的MAIL SUPPORT似乎不太好，相比之下HOTMAIL的就好多了。 每次我的HOTMAIL信箱出问题，向SUPPORT发MAIL后，几个小时之内问题 就能解决 -- 而且一定是有人做了修复的。：)象YAHOO那样的执著的反 复的自动对答，是最惹人厌的。 ：)怀疑方丈大人冒充成年人？这事儿可以找JERRY YANG评评理去。如果 方丈未成年，那JERRY可能也还在上小学呢。不过还是先多收集一些资料 好，或者能否找到一个较好的向“人”反映问题的路子？ 用HOTMAIL当然是可以的，不过如果用YAHOO做HOME的话，YAHOO MAIL要方便得多。 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 27 04:55:34 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail11.listbot.com ([204.71.191.9]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA22319 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 06:55:33 -0500 Received: (qmail 18598 invoked by uid 108); 27 Apr 2000 11:53:33 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 26728 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2000 11:53:34 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (HELO mx.emailqueue.net) (209.240.140.250) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 27 Apr 2000 11:53:34 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (209.75.4.15) by mx.emailqueue.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA77800 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 04:51:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fang@xys2.org) Received: from default (default [209.68.218.237]) by mail.xys2.org with SMTP id K540q9A2 Thu, 27 Apr 2000 04:51:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000427044742.008ac330@xys2.org> X-Sender: fang@xys2.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 04:47:42 -0700 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] 不媚不煽的阿待 In-Reply-To: <20000426034119.56466.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 106 - http://www.xys.org At 03:41 AM 4/26/00 GMT, you wrote: > >　　如果非要说阿待的小说有什么不好的地方的话，那就是她的语言显得太过 >中规中矩，相对而言缺乏个人色彩。另外，也就是故事的不媚不煽了：有时候 小说的语言不同于散文、诗歌，优秀者并不在于文字的个性，而在于叙述的层次 感和刻划的精致。所以诗歌、散文一经翻译就没了味道，而小说经过翻译后却不 会怎么失真。我们读博尔赫斯、卡夫卡的小说，仍然会被其语言的力度所震撼。 阿待的语言从容大气，正有一种内敛的力度，在网上小说写手中难得一见，更 何况一贯如此。就以《水强的水枪》为例，写水强之死： 　　“他倒下了，身体抽搐着，一会儿也就不动了，胸前一片血迹。那雪白的、然 而却散发出呛人的餐馆油烟味儿的衬衫一下子就被浸染得鲜红。那血就象春天的 小河一样，顺着白衬衫下由他的躯体所造成的弧线，泛滥到了水泥街面。一个披 头散发的女人尖叫着，从两个石头狮子之间的朱红大门里飞蹿出来。月光下，她 的头发飞扬，金光闪闪的睡衣下摆往身体两边展开，露出一对光滑、洁白、娇嫩 的大腿。她奔到街上，冲入“聚光灯”下，一眼盯住躺在街面上的他，盯住他胸 膛上那几个血肉模糊的枪洞，两行热泪从她充满了恐怖，但仍然柔和的眼睛里夺 眶而出。如果他还能看见的话，一定会微笑的。” 从容不迫却又一波三折、层次分明，白描与比喻，描写与想象都融合在了一 起，强烈的色彩反差对比出感情的错综复杂，最后以“微笑”为悲剧收尾，正是 所谓小说的“文学语言”。但网上读者的欣赏水准其实普遍不高，大家又多只做 消遣阅读，滥情、油滑的文字也就更受青睐。 >《新语丝》电子月刊：http://www.xys.org/issues.html >阿待的部分小说：http://www.xys.org/pages2/adai.html > 如果是给国内报刊的，最好用国内版的地址。 方舟子 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 27 06:43:58 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA22626 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 08:43:57 -0500 Received: (qmail 28791 invoked by uid 108); 26 Apr 2000 05:55:19 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 8519 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 05:58:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mutt.freemail.ne.jp) (210.235.164.41) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 05:58:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 5521 invoked by alias); 26 Apr 2000 14:52:27 +0900 Received: (qmail 5493 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2000 14:52:26 +0900 Received: from peko.canotec.co.jp (HELO mail) (202.228.180.193) by 210.235.164.41 with SMTP; 26 Apr 2000 14:52:26 +0900 Message-ID: <01d201bfaf43$7b8a6400$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> From: "freemail" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" References: <20000419160658.GQMO423.fep4.online.sh.cn@default> <000501bfaa7d$3c506980$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> <20000424125118.16774.qmail@hotmail.com> <004601bfae61$1ca1f4e0$7c02a8c0@mail.canotec.co.jp> <000801bfb01a$c32ce1c0$39d16aca@xiaolan> Subject: [xys_friends] =?gb2312?B?UmU6IFt4eXNfZnJpZW5kc10gv6rUqs2osabHrg==?= Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:51:08 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 107 - http://www.xys.org > > > 比如解释开元通宝的月牙痕,据说是杨贵妃在蜡制模型上玉指一掐而由来. > > 《钱录》卷八： > “右唐高祖开元通宝钱。按《旧唐书》，高祖即位仍用隋五铢钱，武德四年七月 废 > 五铢钱，行开元通宝钱。给事中欧阳询制词及书。其字含八分及隶体，其词先上後下 次 > 左後右读之，自上及左回环读之亦通，流俗谓之开通元宝钱。 > “......以上凡七种，旧谱统谓之甲文钱。《谈宾录》云：初进蜡样日，文德皇 后 > 掐一甲迹，故钱上有掐文。李孝美曰：此钱元字次画端或有挑向左者，世谓之左挑， 俗 > 甚爱重，背文亦有两甲痕者。今按新、旧唐书并云置钱监于洛并幽益等州，又赐秦王 齐 > 王三炉，右仆射裴寂一炉以铸，又五年五月又於桂州置监，则此背文各种，意铸钱者 私 > 为标识以别之耳，不尽如前人所云也。” > > > 庾荷芝 谢谢庾荷芝先生/女士的指正. 对不起,记忆有误,不是杨贵妃而是文德皇后.我在中国的家里收有此币.但觉得印痕太弯 , 不象指甲印.题外话. 生日 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Thu Apr 27 20:12:16 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.18]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA26347 for ; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:12:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 75821 invoked by uid 0); 27 Apr 2000 20:09:58 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 10043 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2000 03:07:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO www.hec-china.com) (202.97.245.115) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 28 Apr 2000 03:07:01 -0000 Received: from fw.hec-china.com (fw.hec-china.com [202.97.245.113]) by www.hec-china.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id LAA01880 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:06:02 -0700 Received: from k370-2.hec-china.com by fw.hec-china.com via smtpd (for www.hec-china.com [202.97.245.115]) with SMTP; 30 Apr 1999 03:32:17 UT Received: from 10 ([10.1.18.33]) by k370-2.hec-china.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id AAA21628 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:04:02 +0800 Message-ID: <001001bfb0be$ca980b20$2112010a@10.1.1.2.8080> From: "jcwj" To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:06:47 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 108 Friends of Xin Yu Si - http://www.xys.org ~{NR?4<{~} ~{NR?4<{AK2]#,BLI+5D4:2]!#NR8)OBImH%#,Ok?4?4K|SP6`BL#,?IR;Us4s7g45@4#,Pm6`3>MA~} ~{E*T`AK2]#,;9SPNR5DA3!#~} ~{2]2;TYDGC4BLAK#,Ub8vJ@=gR22;DGC4?I0.!#~} ~{NR?4<{AKS-4:;(#,;FI+5DS-4:;(!#NRW_9}H%#,Ok?45C8|WPO8P)#,?IR;A>35?*9}@4#,SCN[~} ~{WG5DD`5c=&:ZAKS-4:;(#,R2=&:ZAKNR5DRB=G!#~} ~{;(2;TYDGC4;FAK#,Ub8vJ@=g@o6MOqUR2;5=J,Le?I6"5DFx:_:_5D2TS,!#~} ~{HK2;TYJG2JI+5DAK#,NRCG6%#,?IK|2E3$3v~} ~{AKA=F,R6WS#,IOCf;9SPHKL$9}5D:[<#!#~} ~{FQ9+S";9JGDGC4BL#,Ub8vJ@=g;9JGDGC42;?I0.!#~} ~{NR?4<{R;=X1;?3OB5D6!OcJw#,4xWEQ?0z5D6!OcJw!#NRW_=|G0#,Ok?4?4JG7qD\UR3vR;F,BL~} ~{R6#,?IH4J2C462V9AKR;0c!#~} ~{NR?4<{AKWT<:#,U>TZB71_5DWT<:!#NRW*9}ImH%#,Ok6c?*UbUE09T`5DA3#,?IUbUEA3H4JMJGDc!#~} ~{NRLSAK!#Ll:ZAK!#NRTZP&!#~} ~{:Z05VP#,P&IyR2JG:Z5D!#~} 2000~{#.~}4~{#.~}21 ~{OBNg~} 6~{#:~}08~{P$C+P4#;~}2000~{#.~}4~{#.~}24 ~{VPNg~} 13~{#:~}07~{P$C+B<~} ~{K58xAmR;8vWT<:L}~} ~{G0R;UsWS#,5=4&3>MA7IQo#,35BRHK;D#,MpHgHU1>9mWS=xAK4eR;Qy#,SZJG>MENWEOBSj!#OB~} ~{Sj#,~} ~{OBSj!#?IO'NRDn_6AKR;8vTB#,LlIOOB5DR2V;SP3>MA!#~} ~{G0Ll#,VUSZOBSjAK#,5CRb5X5==VIOR;?4#,3>MA5DH7JGC;SPAK#,?I6`AKPm6`D`?S#,O]Ze#,~} ~{W]:a~} ~{=;4m5D35U^S!#,C#H;>YWc2;6(5DPPHK#,R;819mWS8U8U37MK:s5D3!>0!#LlGg#,LlGg!#?IO'~} ~{NRDn~} ~{_6AKH}Ll#,Ll;9JGRu3A3A5D#,OqJGT$UWWE;a7"IzJ2C42;:C5DJBGi!#~} ~{9{H;#,=qLlNR7"OV#,5%N;5gDT5D5gWSPEOd1;7b5tAK#,2;V*JGT]J15D;9JGRT:s>MR;V1UbC4~} ~{Qy~} ~{AK!#NR2;V*5@#,C;SPAK5gWSPEOd#,Iz;n;aTuQy!#NROk6M;XAK2R;>2#,PDGi:C~} ~{Fp~} ~{@4!#?IB%OB5D35IyBt2KIy7VCw2;Ok=LNR02>2OB@4!#~} ~{=*S}:c5DIyRtTuD\:MUbP)PzOy6T?9DX!#~} ~{Hg9{NRSPAK5gDT!*!*?IJGBr5gDT5DG.TZDD@o#?~} ~{Hg9{NRW!TZR;8v8tRtP'9{:C5D7?WS@o!*!*?IJGBrUbQy7?WS5DG.TZDD@o#?~} ~{Hg9{NROVTZ3i5DQLJGBfMUEF!*!*?IJGBrBfMU5DG.TZDD@o#?~} ~{RrN*UbP)!0Hg9{!16<2;D\J5OV#,KyRTNRS&8C=SJ\OVJ5#,2;8COkCwLl5DJB!#~} ~{N4@42;TZNR;9TZ!#~} ~{V;JG#,NR6TN4@4JG8v<+4s5DM~P2!#~} ~{;9SP<8Ll>MJGNeR;AK#,Tx>-SP9}R;P)MxSQNJNR#,NeR;H%DD@oMfQ=#?NRR2Tx>-@O@OJ5J55D~} ~{;X4p~} ~{#:TZMOqUbQL;92;9;SP>"R;Qy!#40Mb;9JGDGC433#,DGP)HK2;PhR*MxBg#,2;Ph~} ~{R*5g~} ~{WSPEOd#,V;PhR*Bt5tJVVP5DILF7#,;;@4?IA/5DR;5cG.#,HCWT<:?IRT2;VASZ6vK@!#:MK{CG~} ~{1HFp~} ~{@4#,NR;9JGPR8#5D#,<4J9NeR;V;SPTZ0A5DGsFrU_#,5+C|TK1HNR;9R*~} ~{=>0A~} ~{5C6`!#~} ~{CwLl;aHg:N#?;9JGSjLl#?B7IO;9JG9mS04141Bp#?~} ~{2;H%OkAK0I#,74U}NRC;SPQ!Tq!#NRD\Wv5DV;JG0QUfJ55DWT<:T6T64SOVJ50~@k#,7E7I5=R;~} ~{8vN^~} ~{1HWTSI5DLl5X!#~} ~{>MHCNR0QG{?GAtTZUb8vOVJ5J@=g@o0I!#S@2;TY;a#,:MDG8v=SJ\C|TK5DNR!#~} ~{UfJ55DNR#,J2C46 Received: from lbmail1.listbot.com ([204.71.191.23]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA27223 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:41:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 29003 invoked by uid 108); 27 Apr 2000 18:11:43 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 14710 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2000 18:09:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.112) by lb1.listbot.com with SMTP; 27 Apr 2000 18:09:51 -0000 Received: from wanghe ([61.128.147.18]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FTO006IIKHW1Y@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:03:34 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 23:21:41 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: Re: [xys_friends] =B2=BB=C3=C4=B2=BB=C9=BF=B5=C4=B0=A2=B4=FD?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FTO006IJKHX1Y@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id AAA27223 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 109 - http://www.xys.org 俺近乎偏持地认为小说是要讲究情节的，现流行的许多网上网下小说，似乎 都喜欢意识流和散文化，不那么讲究情节铺垫和戏剧化高潮这类传统手法了。 俺觉得阿待这方面坚持得最好，功力深厚，不那么玩虚的。俺相信她想玩虚 的也是玩得下来的。 俺前一段对国内的网络文学创作多留了一点意，有好的，但不多。所以有人 讲中国网络文学的主流是酸奶文化，最多加了点唯美主义，俺不敢表示反对。 俺若反对这类说法，就举阿待的系列小说为例。但人家说得是主流，阿待不 是主流，这让俺感到遗憾。 辣椒茄子，各有所爱。俺想俺大概是赶不上潮流了。 螳螂 在 00-4-27 4:47:00 Shi-min Fang写道： > - http://www.xys.org > >At 03:41 AM 4/26/00 GMT, you wrote: >> >>　　如果非要说阿待的小说有什么不好的地方的话，那就是她的语言显得太过 >>中规中矩，相对而言缺乏个人色彩。另外，也就是故事的不媚不煽了：有时候 > >小说的语言不同于散文、诗歌，优秀者并不在于文字的个性，而在于叙述的层次 >感和刻划的精致。所以诗歌、散文一经翻译就没了味道，而小说经过翻译后却不 >会怎么失真。我们读博尔赫斯、卡夫卡的小说，仍然会被其语言的力度所震撼。 >阿待的语言从容大气，正有一种内敛的力度，在网上小说写手中难得一见，更 >何况一贯如此。就以《水强的水枪》为例，写水强之死： > >　　“他倒下了，身体抽搐着，一会儿也就不动了，胸前一片血迹。那雪白的、然 >而却散发出呛人的餐馆油烟味儿的衬衫一下子就被浸染得鲜红。那血就象春天的 >小河一样，顺着白衬衫下由他的躯体所造成的弧线，泛滥到了水泥街面。一个披 >头散发的女人尖叫着，从两个石头狮子之间的朱红大门里飞蹿出来。月光下，她 >的头发飞扬，金光闪闪的睡衣下摆往身体两边展开，露出一对光滑、洁白、娇嫩 >的大腿。她奔到街上，冲入“聚光灯”下，一眼盯住躺在街面上的他，盯住他胸 >膛上那几个血肉模糊的枪洞，两行热泪从她充满了恐怖，但仍然柔和的眼睛里夺 >眶而出。如果他还能看见的话，一定会微笑的。” > > 从容不迫却又一波三折、层次分明，白描与比喻，描写与想象都融合在了一 >起，强烈的色彩反差对比出感情的错综复杂，最后以“微笑”为悲剧收尾，正是 >所谓小说的“文学语言”。但网上读者的欣赏水准其实普遍不高，大家又多只做 >消遣阅读，滥情、油滑的文字也就更受青睐。 > >>《新语丝》电子月刊：http://www.xys.org/issues.html >>阿待的部分小说：http://www.xys.org/pages2/adai.html >> > >如果是给国内报刊的，最好用国内版的地址。 > >方舟子 > > >______________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com >---------------------------------------------------------------------- >Advertisement: >Workstation with Monitor under $800! >So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by >the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes >everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. >http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Fri Apr 28 10:13:40 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA29666 for ; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:13:39 -0500 Received: (qmail 5777 invoked by uid 108); 28 Apr 2000 17:11:38 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 23850 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2000 17:10:43 -0000 Received: from law-f227.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (209.185.130.165) by lb3.listbot.com with SMTP; 28 Apr 2000 17:10:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 46220 invoked by uid 0); 28 Apr 2000 17:09:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20000428170949.46219.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.84.137.98 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:09:49 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.84.137.98] From: "Echo Ying" To: xys_friends@listbot.com Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: [xys friends] 不媚不煽的阿待 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:09:49 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 110 - http://www.xys.org >俺近乎偏持地认为小说是要讲究情节的，现流行的许多网上网下小说，似乎 >都喜欢意识流和散文化，不那么讲究情节铺垫和戏剧化高潮这类传统手法了。 因为你要是不意识流不散文化，人家就说你在“讲故事”，而不是 “写小说”啦。:) >俺觉得阿待这方面坚持得最好，功力深厚，不那么玩虚的。俺相信她想玩虚 >的也是玩得下来的。 我想跟年龄阅历也很有关系的吧。 >俺若反对这类说法，就举阿待的系列小说为例。但人家说得是主流，阿待不 >是主流，这让俺感到遗憾。 有时候另类是褒义。比如用于阿待的小说。：) >从容不迫却又一波三折、层次分明，白描与比喻，描写与想象都融合在了一 >起，强烈的色彩反差对比出感情的错综复杂，最后以“微笑”为悲剧收尾， >正是所谓小说的“文学语言”。但网上读者的欣赏水准其实普遍不高，大家 >又多只做消遣阅读，滥情、油滑的文字也就更受青睐。 舟子捧起人来大概也很利害的吧。：) 给你这么一挑出来看，是有味道了。 但是阿待小说里面的比喻并不算出色，这里的血比作春天小河 也很一般。“水强的水枪”里面有一处把天上的月亮比作 大盘子里的月饼还是什么的，倒有些独到之处。 我看文章时候，特别喜欢注意人家的比喻，所以最初喜欢 泰戈尔，到后来钱钟书的“围城”张爱玲的几个名篇，都 因为它们有层出不穷的绝妙比喻让人大饱“眼”福。 应帆 ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Advertisement: Workstation with Monitor under $800! So, you just heard that you need to add how many new workstations by the end of next week? Check out the bundle below. It includes everything you need to get everyone up and running quickly. http://www.listbot.com/links/cdw5 From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 29 03:18:50 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail12.listbot.com ([204.71.191.10]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA01395 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 05:18:49 -0500 Received: (qmail 15887 invoked by uid 108); 29 Apr 2000 10:16:46 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 28437 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2000 10:20:48 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (HELO mx.emailqueue.net) (209.240.140.250) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 29 Apr 2000 10:20:48 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (209.75.4.15) by mx.emailqueue.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA21046 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:14:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fang@xys2.org) Received: from default (default [216.120.1.84]) by mail.xys2.org with SMTP id a52026F0 Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:14:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000429031041.008b6b60@xys2.org> X-Sender: fang@xys2.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:10:41 -0700 To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" From: Shi-min Fang Subject: Re: [xys_friends] Re: [xys friends] 不媚不煽的阿待 In-Reply-To: <20000428170949.46219.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 111 - http://www.xys.org At 05:09 PM 4/28/00 GMT, you wrote: > >舟子捧起人来大概也很利害的吧。：) 呵呵，要让我捧人可不太容易:-) >给你这么一挑出来看，是有味道了。 >但是阿待小说里面的比喻并不算出色，这里的血比作春天小河 >也很一般。“水强的水枪”里面有一处把天上的月亮比作 >大盘子里的月饼还是什么的，倒有些独到之处。 > 比喻不过是雕虫小技，散文、诗歌要看比喻是否新奇，小说嘛， 则是要看是否贴切。 >我看文章时候，特别喜欢注意人家的比喻，所以最初喜欢 >泰戈尔，到后来钱钟书的“围城”张爱玲的几个名篇，都 >因为它们有层出不穷的绝妙比喻让人大饱“眼”福。 > 你还是以读散文、随笔的目光读小说。《围城》和张爱玲的短篇都 散文化、随笔化很严重，在结构上是失败的，算是好文章，却不算 好小说。 方舟子 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 29 04:27:34 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA01556 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:27:33 -0500 Received: (qmail 10974 invoked by uid 108); 29 Apr 2000 11:46:25 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 12033 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2000 11:23:06 -0000 Received: from web1506.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.23.184) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 29 Apr 2000 11:23:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 27997 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Apr 2000 11:23:01 -0000 Message-ID: <20000429112301.27996.qmail@web1506.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.104.86.90] by web1506.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 04:23:01 PDT Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 04:23:01 -0700 (PDT) From: minghy minghy Subject: [xys_friends] 惹人厌烦的张爱玲热 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 112 - http://www.xys.org At 05:09 PM 4/28/00 GMT, you wrote: > >舟子捧起人来大概也很利害的吧。：) 呵呵，要让我捧人可不太容易:-) ：事实上真正值得捧的作者并不太多。关注点总被放在一些包装 精美的垃圾上。 >给你这么一挑出来看，是有味道了。 >但是阿待小说里面的比喻并不算出色，这里的血比作春天小河 >也很一般。“水强的水枪”里面有一处把天上的月亮比作 >大盘子里的月饼还是什么的，倒有些独到之处。 > 比喻不过是雕虫小技，散文、诗歌要看比喻是否新奇，小说嘛， 则是要看是否贴切。 ：基本上赞同这种看法。主教大人做批评家好象蛮在行的：）。 顺便再提一次这些令人难于容忍的流毒 令人厌烦的、没完没了的张爱玲 还有什么香港的迈克（另一个张毒患者，在网上发现他还挺红） 啊，然后是那些追崇他的读者，天！那些丰富的细节比喻总的来 说都是小道也，一般人根本不应该去学他们。结果今天看到徐讦 （一个我喜欢的海派作家）在为於梨华的《梦回青河》做序时对 抗战时沦陷区文学的批评文字，骂张是在卖弄文字（这么说也并 非不成立），感到特别解气。对不对倒在其次了。 流俗容易，脱俗也不是特别难，向俗而雅要有定力的人可以做到。 一般的人，老老实实地不要滥用自己并不擅长的技巧吧，饶了我 们这些看客吧！我们这个时代好象患上了张爱玲病、杜拉丝病， 写字的人不论男女一盖软骨，没病装病，我就不信张爱玲要是有 一个幸福的童年写出来的文字会有后来那份苍凉。虽然我猜她肯 定还是个才女。问题是这些年轻人本身都不象是活腻味了的，干 嘛这么欣赏病态张爱玲（她是没办法，环境造成的）？年复一年， 文学青年们为她聪明才智之下的那些令人目眩的小技巧所迷狂， 追随着她写下一份又一份歪歪唧唧不知所云的漂亮文字。你会比 喻？好，我也来，我来让你头晕脑涨看个饱，新奇吗？就是，我 自己都觉得特立独行哩！至于文章到底表达了什么意思，作者本 人即使真的清楚，也成了次要环节。 张爱玲可是好学的？杜拉丝又是能学的来的？说的难听一些，这 二位都不是一般人眼里的正常人，她们固然有天纵的才气，文字 值得欣赏，但并不值得提倡。天才本来也是学不来的。我国的当 代女作家中，很有一些是这二位的追随者，依我看也多少有些入 错了巷。 艺术家至紧要要有个性、有创造力，把别人学的再好再象也难于 成器（倒不一定要成大器，各有因缘），更何况大部分人根本本 末倒置，不问青红皂白地在那跟风。 至于我，老老实实地鼓吹我喜欢的於梨华就好了，作为女作家她 写法传统而笔力雄健，她把普通人的性格刻画的入木三分，还有 她那份对于民众、特别对于时代女性的关注都是现在一般的作者 所缺乏的。 再强调一点，我并不是想也没资格批评这两位如今的文坛上鼎鼎 有名、如雷贯耳的中外女作家。 泥 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 29 19:09:49 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA03970 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:09:49 -0500 Received: (qmail 9940 invoked by uid 108); 30 Apr 2000 02:28:43 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 9669 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2000 02:06:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep3.online.sh.cn) (202.96.209.76) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 30 Apr 2000 02:06:49 -0000 Received: from surf ([61.129.131.229]) by fep3.online.sh.cn (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with SMTP id <20000430020453.DVUE5897.fep3.online.sh.cn@surf> for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:04:53 +0800 Message-ID: <002501bfb248$93651d10$de64a8c0@surf> From: "翔宇" To: "新语丝之友" Subject: [xys_friends] 关于乱码 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:05:35 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 113 - http://www.xys.org 肖毛： 你的大作传到我这儿全是乱码。 问题就在BASE64 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 在OUTLOOK中选择“工具”菜单“选项”命令。 在弹出的对话框中选择“发送”页。单击“纯文本设置” 在MIME框中选择“无”或选择UUENCODE。 单击“HTML设置”钮，在MIME中选择“无” 再试试看！ 有其它什么问题你可以将问题写在附件中寄给我。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sat Apr 29 22:06:29 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail10.listbot.com ([204.71.191.8]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA04746 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:06:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 25468 invoked by uid 108); 30 Apr 2000 05:04:27 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 9919 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2000 05:02:35 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (HELO mx.emailqueue.net) (209.240.140.250) by lb2.listbot.com with SMTP; 30 Apr 2000 05:02:35 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (209.75.4.15) by mx.emailqueue.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA34068 for ; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:02:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fang@xys2.org) Received: from default (default [216.120.8.46]) by mail.xys2.org with SMTP id 4o40asA2 Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:02:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000429215821.008d1570@xys2.org> X-Sender: fang@xys2.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:58:21 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] “绝不退却”的悲壮和“百家争鸣”的悲哀（一） Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 114 - http://www.xys.org “绝不退却”的悲壮和“百家争鸣”的悲哀 ·方舟子· 一 那是自中世纪以来对科学家的最大一次迫害。地点在苏联，起因则是进化论的 两位创建人对进化机制的不同看法：拉马克相信在生物内在欲望的驱使下的用进废 退是生物适应环境的原因，而达尔文则认为适者生存的自然选择才是进化的主要动 力。我们或许会觉得，拉马克主义更象是唯心主义，而唯物主义的达尔文主义应该 更受马克思主义的青睐才对。但苏联的官方哲学，与其说是马克思主义的，不如说 是唯意志主义的，它更相信所谓“人的主观能动性”。早在1906年，一位叫斯大林 的年轻布尔什维克就已论述说，新拉马克主义正在战胜新达尔文主义，而这再一次 证明了恩格斯的从量变到质变的唯物辩证法之正确。但是与斯大林的预言相反，从 二十年代起，遗传学的发展越来越显示了新拉马克主义的错误，新达尔文主义的正 确，这个遗传学和进化论的综合过程，到五十年代最终完成。 苏联政权对遗传学的蓬勃发展抱着深深的敌意，遗传学成了资产阶级科学的典 型。这除了意识形态的原因，还有实用的因素。从1928年起，苏联开始强迫建立集 体农庄，被剥夺了财产和权利的农民们以屠宰牲畜、销毁粮食、消极怠工抗议，农 业生产受到了灾难性的破坏。苏联迫切地需要用技术发明创造农业生产的奇迹。但 是，虽然俄国拥有切特维里科夫、菲利普琴科（这两位大师的群体遗传学方法在他 们的学生杜布赞斯基于1927年移民美国后传播到了西方，为综合进化论的创建起了 关键作用）、瓦维洛夫等一批遗传学的杰出先驱者，还处于实验阶段的年轻的遗传 学对农业生产还无法提供太大的帮助。从理论上说，用达尔文主义的方法改进物种 也要比拉马克主义缓慢得多。相信后天获得性能够遗传的拉马克主义表达了一种快 速发展的良好愿望：如果那是真的，就意味着你的儿子天生就具有了你学到的知识， 而不必一切从头开始。拉马克主义的表述也更为直观，更易被外行接受，直到今天 仍然有许多外行对“用进废退”深信不疑。苏联需要一种新的比资产阶级遗传学更 加先进、更容易为大众接受的无产阶级的遗传学。这个新遗传学需要有偶像和权威。 于是，一位没有受过教育、夸夸其谈的园艺师米丘林便被树立成了新遗传学乃至新 生物学的偶像。这位没落贵族家庭的后代据说在革命前受到沙皇的迫害，在政治上 当然可靠。在理论上，他攻击孟德尔遗传定律是没有普遍意义的“豌豆定律”，主 张获得性能够遗传，强调环境的创造性作用，与造就共产主义一代新人的信念不谋 而合。在实践上，他声称用远缘杂交和嫁接的方法“定向培育”出了六百多个（一 说两百多个）果树新品种，几乎到了随心所欲的地步。再也没有比这种神话式的偶 像更能吸引人的了。“米丘林遗传学”、“米丘林生物学”在共产主义国家成了新 遗传学、新生物学的代名词，即使到了当代，在这些国家，米丘林头上的光环也还 未完全消失。中国也不例外。在1989年版《辞海》的“米丘林”条目，还附有一幅 肖像，这是那些极其重要的正面历史人物才享有的待遇，生物学家中有此殊荣者仅 寥寥数人。但是，我们现在根据遗传学知识可以断定，米丘林用所谓“无性杂交” 创造的“新品种”，如果是真的，也只是一些由不同基因型的细胞组成的嵌合体， 并非新种。米丘林对遗传学乃至生物学毫无贡献，如果不是在他的名义之下所进行 的这场旷日持久的反科学和伪科学运动，米丘林的名字完全可以从生物学史上抹去。 1935年，米丘林在被授予苏联科学院荣誉院士的头衔一周之后去世，未能看到 在他的战旗之下对苏联遗传学家的所进行的有系统、大规模的迫害。其实序幕早已 拉开。在1931和1932年，一批遗传学家被贴上“孟什维克化的唯心主义者”的标签 而赶出科学院，瓦维洛夫创建和领导的列宁全苏农业科学院植物育种研究所则被批 判成“在列宁的名字掩盖下”所建立的“异己阶级的、充满敌意的、彻底反革命的 研究所”。正是在在种政治气氛下，米丘林的继承者李森科正式登上了政治舞台。 此君以“春化处理”（对越冬作物种子进行低温处理后推迟到春天播种）的发明者 自居，而实际上春化处理既不是他的发明（早在1915年嘎斯塔夫·嘎斯讷就已发明 了这种技术），也不是他首次在苏联推广（在1923年马克西莫夫就已用更为严格的 方法做了春化试验，以后他对李森科的技术进行了严厉的批评），他的发明，就是 将那些对推广他的春化处理技术有意见的人称为阶级敌人。1935年，这位农民的儿 子已被树立为“赤脚科学家”的典型，与躲在实验室中的“资产阶级遗传学家”相 对抗。在全苏第二次集体农民突击队员大会上，李森科做了《春化处理是增产的有 力措施》的报告，宣称：“富农破坏分子不仅在集体农庄中有，而且在科学界，他 们的危险性和破坏性也是同样的。为了保护春化处理技术，我们同一些所谓‘学者’ 进行了许多争论，受了不少气；在坚持春化处理的实践中，遭受了种种打击。阶级 敌人永远是阶级敌人，不管他是不是科学家。”斯大林听了，大声喝采：“好，李 森科同志，好！” 就在这一年，李森科先后成为乌克兰科学院院士和全苏农科院院士，并正式提 出了米丘林主义的伪科学理论，否认基因和任何特殊的遗传物质的存在，认为 细胞才是遗传的基础，细胞的任何部分都有遗传性。遗传是有机体和环境相互作用， 将外界条件内化的结果，由外界条件引起的变异都是能够遗传的。遗传学被称之为 孟德尔摩尔根主义，被宣布为资产阶级的、反动的、唯心主义的，与辩证唯物主义 的发展的观点（因为它强调基因的稳定性和连续性）、普遍联系的观点（因为它强 调内部遗传物质的重要性）、主观能动性的观点和有规律的观点（因为它认为突变 是随机的、没有方向的）格格不入的。这种伪科学声称可以通过定向改变环境而 快速改变生物体的性质，正中斯大林加快集体化和工业化的下怀。1936年年底，全 苏农科院举行了一次特殊的会议，按官方的指示要求将“旧”遗传学纳入“米丘林 生物学”。但遗传学家们并不妥协。在这一年，已有三名党员遗传学家阿哥尔、列 文和列维特（人类遗传学学院院长）被宣布为“人民公敌”而被捕，阿哥尔和列文 被枪决，列维特死于狱中，人类遗传学学院被关闭。1937年，瓦维洛夫被宣布为 “人民公敌的帮凶”而撤销了全苏农科院院长的职务，他之后的两任院长和一批农 科院成员被逮捕。1938年，由李森科担任了院长。被米丘林主义者视为头号敌人、 处于危险之中的瓦维洛夫表明了他抗争到底的立场： “我们将走向柴堆，我们将被烧死，但是我们绝不从我们所确信的退却。让我 坦白地告诉你们，我曾经相信，现在也还相信并坚持我所认为的是正确的。……这 是一个事实，仅仅因为身居高位者希望我退却就要我退却，是不可能的。” 原定1937年在莫斯科举行的第七次国际遗传学会议推迟到1939年在英国爱丁堡 举行，没有一个苏联生物学家被允许参加这次会议，包括在1936年当选国际遗传学 会会长的瓦维洛夫。但是国际声誉并没能救得瓦维洛夫。1940年，瓦维洛夫以英国 间谍、破坏分子等罪名被捕，1941年被判处死刑，在死牢中被关了几个月后改判徒 刑。1942年当瓦维洛夫在狱中时，被选为英国王家学会会员。1943年瓦维洛夫死于 狱中，终年56岁，正是科学家的壮年。他的死标志着遗传学在俄国的终结，从那时 到现在，俄国没有出过一位值得一提的遗传学家。大批遗传学家先后被逮捕，有的 被处决，有的死于狱中。如果不是因为德苏战争爆发而转移了苏联政权的注意力， 苏联遗传学家们早已被赶尽杀绝。 第二次世界大战一结束，苏联政权马上开始了整肃知识界的行动。继1946年整 肃文学界，1947年整肃哲学界之后，1948年开始整肃科学界，生物学首当其冲。1948 年7、8月间，在苏共中央的领导下召开了全苏列宁农业科学院会议，残余的几名遗 传学家被“邀请”参加这次近千人的大会接受批判。李森科做了经斯大林修改、苏 共中央批准的《论生物学现状》的报告。遗传学家们在会上一开始还为染色体遗传 学辩护（虽然他们否认自己是孟德尔摩尔根主义者），一旦知道党中央的意图之后， 便声明放弃自己的反动立场－－瓦维洛夫那样的勇士早已被杀光了。这次会议被宣 布为“表现了米丘林路线对孟德尔摩尔根主义的全面胜利”，“彻底粉碎了反动的 魏斯曼、孟德尔、摩尔根主义”。紧接着，苏联科学院和苏联高等教育部也召开会 议做出决定。遗传学家被禁止从事科学研究和教学。与遗传学有关的研究所、实验 室挨个挨个被关闭。撤销一切非米丘林方向的科研计划。遗传学书籍被从图书馆书 架取下，教科书被销毁，课程被取消。任何遗传学的教学和科研实际上在苏联已成 为非法，反对米丘林学说即构成犯罪。 从1948年一直到斯大林死时，苏联科学刊物上没有发表过一篇敢对米丘林学说 有任何异议的文章。斯大林死后，反对的声音开始浮现。最主要的原因，是这个学 说不仅未能对农业生产有任何的效益，反而带来了严重的灾难。李森科竭力主张在 西部西伯利亚播种经春化处理的冬小麦，结果从来也没有得到过收成，甚至连种子 也收不回来。李森科否定生存斗争的存在，将这个观点称为“马尔萨斯主义”、 “庸俗达尔文主义”，自称“创造性的达尔文主义”，认为种内不存在竞争，主张 密植，越密越好，导致作物大批死亡，光是这一损失，估计即达十亿卢布。多倍体、 自交系、辐射育种等遗传育种技术已在世界各国大规模发展，成为农业增产的重要 方法，而苏联在这些方面仍然是一片空白。1956年2月，苏共二十大召开，赫鲁晓 夫做揭露斯大林罪行的报告。4月李森科被迫辞去了全苏农业科学院院长职务，苏 联开始派代表团出席国际遗传学会议，恢复了遗传学研究。但是在1958年，赫鲁晓 夫转而支持李森科，1961年，李森科东山再起，重新担任全苏农业科学院院长，苏 联遗传学研究再次转入地下，改在物理、化学研究所之内偷偷进行。直到1964年10 月赫鲁晓夫下台，苏联遗传学才算获得了合法地位，可以跟米丘林“生物学”平起 平坐了。但是在二、三十年代曾经处于世界领先地位的苏联遗传学，这时已落后了 四分之一世纪。从1938年到60年代初，苏联没有出版过一本遗传学教科书，也没有 一所医学院教遗传学。“独联体”各国仍然在承担这个断层导致的恶果：直到现 在，这些国家的生物学研究水平仍然远远落后于世界水平。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 30 00:10:40 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail9.listbot.com ([204.71.191.7]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA05112 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 02:10:39 -0500 Received: (qmail 13363 invoked by uid 108); 30 Apr 2000 07:08:36 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 2310 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2000 05:44:12 -0000 Received: from web1505.mail.yahoo.com (128.11.23.183) by lb5.listbot.com with SMTP; 30 Apr 2000 05:44:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 2899 invoked by uid 60001); 30 Apr 2000 05:42:58 -0000 Message-ID: <20000430054258.2898.qmail@web1505.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.104.86.90] by web1505.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:42:58 PDT Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:42:58 -0700 (PDT) From: minghy minghy Subject: [xys_friends] 关于写作 To: Friends of Xin Yu Si MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 115 - http://www.xys.org 因为说到小说之道，顺便想要请问各位，还有方舟子你 们认为究竟怎样才能算一篇成功的小说？ 最近市面上那本不太象小说思想性很强的《北京法源寺》 （李敖）算不算好小说？我觉得它还行，可是听说获得 诺贝尔提名。 不知为什么我总觉得写小说比散文、随笔要难。后者可 以说是就事论事，怎么说都是有感而发，书读的多了怎 样都能发两句稍微象样点的牢骚。而小说完全是无中生 有（即使有原型），想象力很重要。写的不好就成了流 水帐目不忍睹。诗歌就不用说了。 泥 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 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Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 30 07:02:06 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail5.listbot.com ([204.71.191.17]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA06141 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 09:02:06 -0500 Received: (qmail 26345 invoked by uid 109); 30 Apr 2000 14:08:15 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 2365 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2000 14:04:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO email.cta.cq.cn) (61.128.128.112) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 30 Apr 2000 14:04:03 -0000 Received: from wanghe ([61.128.148.133]) by email.cta.cq.cn (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.07.30.00.05.p8) with SMTP id <0FTU00H921AGOF@email.cta.cq.cn> for xys_friends@listbot.com; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 21:54:20 +0800 (CST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:12:40 +0800 From: tanglang Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re: [xys_friends] =B9=D8=D3=DA=D0=B4=D7=F7?= To: Friends of Xin Yu Si Message-id: <0FTU00H951AJOF@email.cta.cq.cn> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.0 beta 1 [cn] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by xys.xys.org id JAA06141 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 116 - http://www.xys.org 在 00-4-29 22:42:00 minghy minghy写道： > - http://www.xys.org > >因为说到小说之道，顺便想要请问各位，还有方舟子你 >们认为究竟怎样才能算一篇成功的小说？ 俺觉得金圣叹删过的《水浒传》就是篇很成功的小说，好久 都没看见谁提这本书了，不知道是怎么一回事，不会都忘了 吧？连〈西游记〉都有人提，可俺不喜欢〈西游记〉，象故 事，不象是小说。还有就是〈红楼梦〉和〈三国演义〉。这 四本书是文革期间唯一被恩准印刷发行的书。 俺试着给排个座次： 单从小说架构上论，俺以为〈水浒〉得排第一；从思想和文 笔上论，〈红楼〉第一；从俺自己偏好的内容上论，〈三国〉 第一；从希奇古怪上论，〈西游〉第一。 当今的小说也有不少好的。但俺不说。：） >最近市面上那本不太象小说思想性很强的《北京法源寺》 >（李敖）算不算好小说？我觉得它还行，可是听说获得 >诺贝尔提名。 >不知为什么我总觉得写小说比散文、随笔要难。后者可 >以说是就事论事，怎么说都是有感而发，书读的多了怎 >样都能发两句稍微象样点的牢骚。而小说完全是无中生 >有（即使有原型），想象力很重要。写的不好就成了流 >水帐目不忍睹。诗歌就不用说了。 > >泥 各有各的难处，写好了都不容易。但有一点可以肯定，就是 小说最不好捧。：） 就拿网上来说吧，容易捧红的大多是散文和随笔；难得听说 那个写小说的被捧红过，被骂红倒是有可能。 螳螂 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Sun Apr 30 21:30:33 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail8.listbot.com ([204.71.191.6]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA09057 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:30:32 -0500 Received: (qmail 13350 invoked by uid 108); 1 May 2000 04:28:48 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 14897 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 03:45:56 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (HELO mx.emailqueue.net) (209.240.140.250) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 1 May 2000 03:45:56 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (209.75.4.15) by mx.emailqueue.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA57362 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:39:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fang@xys2.org) Received: from default (default [209.68.218.223]) by mail.xys2.org with SMTP id pH50LMB2 Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:39:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000430203543.0086dca0@xys2.org> X-Sender: fang@xys2.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:35:43 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] 2000年美国家庭基金会“邪教与新千年”年会报告 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 117 - http://www.xys.org 2000年美国家庭基金会“邪教与新千年”年会报告 自闲 美国家庭基金会（American Family Foundation）于4月28-29日两天，在西雅图南 部的杜马斯海湾会议中心举行了题为《邪教与新千年》研讨会。参加会议的有美国 “思想自由”(Freedom of Mind)组织的Hassan，Middlebury 大学的Rochford教授， 加州大学伯克莱分校的Singer教授，法国CCMM的总裁Raffi，Mission Interministéerielle de Lutte Centre de Sectes的Denis Barthelemy，欧洲异 端教派问题研究中心的Nokin，英国FAIR(Family Action and Information Resources) 团体的总干事，英国伦敦经济和政治科学的社会学教授Eileen Barber，日本研究 奥姆教的Hirata律师，Nishida教授，Hidaka-Shimura牧师，德国研究“科学教” (Scientology) 的代表，加拿大的S. Kent教授，北京的万海岩，中国驻三藩使总 领事馆的公共关系领事杨晓忠。自闲代表方舟子也参加了这次研讨会并宣读了两人 合写的论文。美国著名的心理学家M. T. Singer，研究法论功的P. Rahn 在“法论功” 专题上作了论文报告。与会的研究人员有一百多人。美国家庭基金会的会长Herbert Rosedale，执行干事Michael Lagone也参加并主持了会议。 关于“美国家庭基金会” 美国家庭基金会成立于1979年，是一个非盈利的研究、教育机构（www.csj.org)。 它的任务是研究心理控制，特别是与邪教有关的心理行为。它的方法是通过科学的 研究支持对公众的教育，帮助专业工作者，和受邪教影响的家庭和个人。它在美国 有150各义务的专业人士对各个异端教派进行研究，也与欧洲的民间研究和反邪教团 体有密切的联系。这次会议的研究对象有：韩国的统一教会，美国和欧洲的科学教， 东欧的异端教派，美国的天堂之门，三K党和极右组织，中国和美国的法论功，和日 本的奥姆真理教等。 关于“法论功”的研究 Singer教授是世界上研究心理压力和研究邪教的先驱。她早年的著作包括“Cults in Our Midst”（邪教就在我们身边），和“'Crazy'Therapies：What are They？ Do They Work？”她为“邪教”定的7个标准是这方面研究的基础：1 有一个自命的救 世主，他拥有特殊的知识可以解救信徒；2 魅力（Charisma）；3 热衷于发展信徒； 4 划分我－他，排他性，认为只有“我”方可得救，“他”不可得救；5 自我中心， 崇拜“大师”；6 双重道德标准；7 威权主义，独裁的管理手法。Singer教授认为， 法论功符合所有的标准。她从法轮功寄给她的材料得知，法轮功认为“邪教”是“群 居，和非自愿”的组织。Singer教授认为这个定义只有法轮功自己采用。世界上的邪 教实行群居的极少，而加入的成员都是自愿的。因此，邪教要采用欺骗的手段来吸引 教徒，并让他们放弃思考成为邪教的工具。 据Singer教授报告，一年来她咨询了44个法论功家庭，其中35个是华人背景的家庭。 与她联系的华人家庭（家长）都是女性。她们求助的原因基本相同：她们的孩子、孙 子、弟弟突然不与家庭联系了。家人与他们通电话，他们听起来就象是录音电话一样 宣读《转法轮》。其中最令人不安的是，这些弟子认为家人是“魔”。他们认为不信 法轮功的人，包括亲人都是与弟子对立的。 Singer教授认为，法轮功是一个危险的邪教。她认为法轮功的宣传手段也十分犀利。 在她接受加拿大电台一次采访后，她的办公室就收到了大量来自加拿大和纽约的“法 轮大法”的宣传材料。系的秘书告诉她，系的办公室快放不下她收到的邮包了。 P. Rahn的研究课题是法轮功的“宽容”和宣传手段。根据她自己的经验，在密执根大 学的（电子网络）学术论坛上她就被一个受过高等教育的法轮功信徒谩骂。与法轮功 弟子进行理性的讨论并不容易。Rahn女士称，她认为西方媒体的对法轮功的误解是法 轮功宣传成功的结果。法轮功把人权问题与他们的邪教行为等同，在西方得到了新闻 界的同情。到目前，美国新闻界关于法轮功的消息来源只有三个：法轮功、中国政府、 “卢四清”的中国人权信息中心。在目前的环境下新闻界对法轮功的判断就受到法轮 功和“卢四情”的影响。 方舟子与自闲的论文题目是《法轮功两面观：和平的外衣，危险的思想》，内容是关 于如何理解法轮功的理论和实践。我们批评法轮功邪教，是因为它对人类的危害。李 洪志编导的“教义”充满了矛盾，它蔑视人类的观点是对人的极大侮辱。在文中，我 们反驳了法轮功的教义，分析了它的控制手法、和“师父”与“弟子”的威权－依赖 关系。我们认为，批判法轮功与开放社会没有冲突。 在“世界各地邪教”专题上，万海岩提出了另一个应该引起关注的问题：统一教派 （Unification Church）对中国的渗透。统一教派打着民间团体的名义，大量地以教 育为名在中国发展。为此，我们应该提高警觉：邪教就在我们身边。 ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com From fang@xys.org Mon May 1 00:04:20 2000 -0700 Return-Path: Received: from lbmail4.listbot.com ([204.71.191.16]) by xys.xys.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA09508 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 02:04:20 -0500 Received: (qmail 19147 invoked by uid 108); 1 May 2000 07:23:19 -0000 Mailing-List: ListBot mailing list contact xys_friends-help@listbot.com Delivered-To: mailing list xys_friends@listbot.com Reply-To: "Friends of Xin Yu Si" Received: (qmail 29399 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 07:05:56 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (HELO mx.emailqueue.net) (209.240.140.250) by lb4.listbot.com with SMTP; 1 May 2000 07:05:56 -0000 Received: from mx0.emailqueue.net (209.75.4.15) by mx.emailqueue.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA16655 for ; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:59:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from fang@xys2.org) Received: from default (default [209.68.218.244]) by mail.xys2.org with SMTP id 7u60dyC2 Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:59:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000430235541.00857780@xys2.org> X-Sender: fang@xys2.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:55:41 -0700 To: xys_friends@listbot.com From: Shi-min Fang Subject: [xys_friends] “绝不退却”的悲壮和“百家争鸣”的悲哀（二） Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 118 - http://www.xys.org 二 在人民共和国建国之前，中国的遗传学家基本都有留美、留欧背景，其中也不 乏在摩尔根实验室学习、研究、得过博士学位的（象李汝祺、谈家祯等人）。他们 回国后大都在大学任教和从事研究，已为中国遗传学的发展打下了基础。建国后， 李森科的《论生物学现状》一文在中国大量印行，成为大学生物系和农业院校的必 读文件。苏联伪生物学家纷纷应聘来华传播伪生物学。1952年，中国开展知识分子 思想改造运动，遗传学家们都受到了批判。这一年6月29日，《人民日报》发表了 题为《为坚持生物科学的米丘林方向而斗争》的文章，批判“反动的”、“唯心主 义的”摩尔根学派，严厉指责“当前我们生物科学的状况已经到了不能容忍的地 步”、“各大学中生物科学各部门基本原封不动，旧生物学的观点仍然贯穿在课程 的各个方面”，勒令“要用米丘林生物科学彻底改造生物科学的各个部门”、“从 批判旧生物学、旧遗传学工作中来学习米丘林生物科学”。从这一年秋季起，遗传 学课程在各大学基本被取消，遗传学研究全部被停顿，而改以伪生物学研究取代。 遗传学家们虽然一般仍留在原单位，但全部被改行从事其他方面的教学或研究工作。 遗传育种材料被销毁，试验田被铲除。甚至直到1955年，李森科在苏联已遭到批评， 而在中国仍然对之视若神明。中国科学院植物研究所研究员胡先〔马肃〕在这一年 出版的《植物分类学简编》一书中，因对李森科“创造性达尔文主义”的一些观点 提出异议，被全部销毁。1955年10月底在北京召开的纪念米丘林诞生一百周年大会 上，胡研究员受到了政治批判。 1956年4月，传来了李森科辞职的消息。中共中央也在这时候提出了“百花齐 放，百家争鸣”的口号，指定在遗传学领域树立“百家争鸣”的榜样。于是在1956 年8月，由中国科学院和高等教育部共同主持，在青岛召开了约一百三十人参加 的遗传学座谈会。遗传学家和米丘林主义者在这次会议上一起讨论遗传学问题，至 今仍被视为“百家争鸣”的典范，用我在大学本科时一位老师的话说：为中国遗传 学的发展立了大功。 这次会议，如其名称所表示的，并非一次学术讨论会，而是座谈会，更确切地 说，是一次遗传学家向米丘林主义者普及遗传学的基本常识的会议。参加会议的许 多人，在发言之前都声明自己是外行，从其发言内容看，倒也并非谦虚。童第周、 朱洗等实验胚胎学家对基因学说还有所怀疑是可以理解的，因为在生物个体发育过 程中的基因调控机制也只是近十几年来才研究得比较透彻，在当时还一无所知。但 是，会上米丘林主义者对遗传学的攻击，即使是按当时的水准，也是极其低下的。 他们全然不懂基因型和表现型、后天获得性和自然选择的区别，不具有遗传学的基 本概念。华东农业科学研究所研究员、室主任奚元龄竟然还用细菌的抗药性来证明 后天获得性的正确，不知道早在四十年代微生物遗传学实验就已证明了那是自然选 择的结果。即使是遗传学家们，由于已多年被禁止从事遗传学工作，各种遗传学期 刊自1949年起就被停订，对国际遗传学的进展也大多不了解。在整个座谈会中，只 有中国科学院生理生化研究所副研究员王德宝提到了在三年前华森和克里克就已做 出的DNA双螺旋结构这一划时代的发现，还不忘小心翼翼地声明“并不能算做定论， 我们对于DNA的构造知道得还很有限。” 除了漠视科学事实之外，米丘林主义者从发言中还表现出逻辑思维混乱、没 有掌握科学方法，根本就不具有从事科研的能力。比如华南农学院教授王仲彦在长 篇介绍了他们做的“无性杂种”证明米丘林学说的实验之后，承认还存在缺点， “（1）没有原种对比，科学性不够。（2）所观察的对象仅为外部性状，外部性状 是容易变异的，对遗传性的影响如何尚须深入研究。”他不知道，这两点就使他 的实验毫无价值，没有对照的实验，不仅是“科学性不够”，而根本就是“没有任 何科学性”。难怪北京农业大学教授李竞雄认为“论争的焦点，还在于共同语言， 共同语言不仅只是事实，还包括实验材料、方法、结果的解释以及科学定义等。” 然而整个会议中最令人哭笑不得的，是米丘林主义者几乎一致地认为遗传学的 发展恰好证明了米丘林学说的正确。武汉大学生物系教授何定杰说，用于证明DNA 是遗传物质的肺炎球菌实验正好证明了后天获得性能够遗产（我将他的话看了几遍， 至今不明白他是如何推导出这个结论的），“由此可见，摩尔根遗传学，近年的发 展，已大大的接近于米丘林遗传学。”“从摩尔根遗传学的发展趋势看来，它不是 与米丘林遗传学背道而驰，而是一天一天的接近于米丘林遗传学，朝着米丘林遗传 学方向发展着。”中国科学院植物研究所遗传研究室副研究员梁正兰说：“我听了 几位先生介绍摩尔根学派的发展，许多工作是很有意思的。基因的概念不象以前那 样，而有了新的发展。我相信这是因为许多新的研究成果不能不使这种理论有所修 改的结果。基因概念的这种发展是很好的。在我看来在某种程度上和米丘林学说比 以前接近了些。”该研究室副研究员李〔王番〕则指责遗传学家将基因学说当成了 “绝对真理”，“正因为如此，在摩尔根遗传学中，直到今日，在理论上看不见什 么发展和创见。”该研究室主任祖德明在会后总结文章中，也声称摩尔根学派最近 “渐渐觉察到细胞质特别是环境条件对于遗传的巨大作用，从而初步解开了染色体 基因学说的束缚。”看来这个中国遗传研究的权威机构（当时遗传研究所还未成立） 就没有一个遗传学家！ 对于这些在现在看来极其可笑甚至可以说相当无耻的论调，当时的遗传学家们 又是怎么反应的呢？除了李竞雄教授敢于针锋相对地、极其正确地指出米丘林学派 “抹煞了一百多年来生物科学发展的事实，而回到一百多年前去了。”其他遗传学 家都采取了一种回避、退让、调和的态度。北京大学生物系教授李汝祺跟他的“师 弟”、复旦大学生物系教授谈家祯说要“走中间路线”，会上走中间路线的人的确 不少，象“孟德尔和米丘林学派都有片面性，应该截长补短，互相补充，融合起来， 希望我们遗传学成为一门创造性的科学”（浙江农学院教授陆星垣的发言）之类的 骑墙说法出自几乎每个发言者的口中，若不查其师承，难以认定他们是遗传学家还 是米丘林主义者。如果说这是碍于情面不好当面发生冲突，那么会后的总结文章也 一样试图调和。谈家祯教授会后在《人民日报》上撰文说：“我认为米丘林提出的 定向培育理论，标志着人类控制和改造生物类型的崇高愿望，可能把遗传学、甚至 整个生物学的发展方向提到更高的阶段。”“从摩尔根学派最近开展的有关细胞质 遗产和微生物定向变异的初步研究成果来看，摩尔根学派不是同米丘林学说的基本 精神没有一点共同的基础的。”等于是认同了米丘林主义者的“先进”谰言了。山 东大学生物系教授方宗熙会后在《生物学通报》上一面指出摩尔根主义“成为现代 生物学的极其重要的知识，成为现代生物学的基本理论。因此，现代遗传学的研究 应该以它为基础。”一面又赞扬“米丘林学说所强调的定向改造遗传性使生物更好 地为人类服务的方向，是生物学发展的一个新方向，这样的方向符合于祖国社会主 义建设的需要，也符合于科学发展的前途。”也一样是承认“米丘林生物学”之 “新”。 其实当局的既定政策，就是在“百家争鸣”的口号下让两家和平共处。中国科学 院生物学地学部副主任童第周在致开幕词时，已指出“苏联的科学精神”和“米丘 林学说”是碰不得的：“在学习苏联的先进科学中还不能很好地领会苏联的科学精 神”、“几年来我们虽然学习了米丘林学说，因为体会不深，在研究上和教育上主 要根据李森科学说来进行工作和教导学生”，而这次会议的用意，就是要解决“过 去摩尔根学说被批判了，不敢介绍；现在李森科学说也被批判了，更觉得无所适从” 的尴尬。中宣部科学处处长于光远随后发言，为整个会议定下了基调：“遗传学的 两个学派应该互相学习，互相补充。”会议的目的，看来是达到了。按照童第周先 生在词闭幕所言，这次座谈会一致认为：“摩尔根学说的研究和米丘林学说的研究， 都应当发展，都应当扩大它们的领域。本着提高我国科学技术水平，十二年内达到 国际标准的共同目标，各学派之间互相学习，互相批评，这对于遗传学的发展，不 但没有妨碍，相反地将会起很大的作用。”象李竞雄教授这样的“极端”分子不平 之鸣，也就只是整个会议中个别的不和谐声音。《人民日报》在会后发的报道《一 个成功的学术会议》批评这些“极端”分子说： “有个别摩尔根学派的科学家，曾经要求会议作出我们遗传学应该按照摩尔根 学派方向发展的结论，认为只有采用摩尔根主义的方法才能在十二年内赶上遗传学 的国际水平；认为在高等学校中应该只讲授摩尔根学派的细胞遗传学等。这些看法， 受到其他科学家，包括一些摩尔根学派科学家的反对，他们认为这是和‘百家争鸣’ 的精神不符的，是和实际情况不符的。” 今天读到这些话，只有让人感到悲哀。当局的如意算盘，是觉得遗传学和米丘 林主义各说对了一半真理，科学的发展会使它们统一起来。但这种美妙的情景在科 学史上极其罕见。历史早已证明，正确的恰恰是那些和“百家争鸣”的精神不符的 个别的遗传家。我忍不住要设想：假设会议能够做出按照摩尔根学派方向发展的结 论，而不是浪费宝贵的科研资源支持、纵容一个真正反动的（无视一百多年来生物 学的发展）、唯心主义的（否认遗传的物质基础）伪科学流派；假设中学、高等学 校从此只讲授遗传学，而不是同时讲授米丘林主义误人子弟……今天中国的遗传学 水平也不会是这个样子了。可惜历史无法假设，而今天中国遗传学与国际水平的差 距，大约也还是十二年。 这种“百家争鸣”一直持续了下去，六十年代遗传密码的破译、七十年代克隆 技术的发明都没能结束这种局面。到了八十年代，遗传学已进入分子时代达三十年 之久，被定为“米丘林生物学”研究基地的武汉大学生物系还出了一本《米丘林遗 传学》的教科书。当我无意中在中国科技大学的图书馆阅览室浏览到这本书的时 候，其感觉，就象是在一堆高科技产品中突然见到了一件古董。 三 美国伟大的遗传学家、诱发突变的发现者穆勒在三十年代时曾经应瓦维洛夫的 邀请到苏联工作过几年。他们希望能够并肩对抗正在崛起的米丘林主义。穆勒参加 了1936年的列宁全苏农学院会议，在会上做了最激烈的发言，指控李森科及其同党 是打着辩证唯物主义旗号的唯心主义者。他将遗传学和米丘林主义的对抗，比做是 医学和巫术、天文学和占星术的对抗。第二年，穆勒灰溜溜地离开了苏联。在一个 极权政府决定全力支持伪科学的时候，科学只有一败涂地，科学家的肉体甚至会因 此被消灭。 虽然在青岛会议之后，中国的决策者没有采取象苏联政权那样极端的做法，但 是“百家争鸣”的号召，在允许遗传学教学和研究的同时，也保护、支持了米丘林 主义伪科学的教学和研究。如果没有政府的干预、支持，这种毫无事实依据的伪科 学教学和研究根本不可能维持下去。在西方国家，米丘林主义从来就没有市场，而 只被视为笑柄。 中国的科学家并非对科学方法没有清醒的认识，但是他们只能与政府的既定政 策保持一致。李汝祺教授在青岛会议上就指出：“科学的标准和对科学的态度，一 方面决定于科学的事实，同时亦决定于逻辑。”对米丘林主义者不顾科学事实，不 符逻辑的思维，有相当尖锐的批评。但是他在1957年4月29日《光明日报》上发表 《从遗传学谈百家争鸣》的文章，为了“百家争鸣”的局面，仍不得不承认米丘林 主义的价值，想象“不久的将来，通过具体的研究工作，遗传学中目前存在的两个 学派，会逐渐融合为一”。毛泽东命令《人民日报》转载这篇文章，并给加上了新 的题目《发展科学的必由之路》，从此就有了一个论断，叫做“百家争鸣是发展科 学的必由之路”。1985年青岛会议记录出版时，书名就叫做《百家争鸣－－发展科 学的必由之路》。 如果我们按官方的定义，将“百家”理解为不同的派别，那么科学的发展，并 不是必然要经由百家争鸣。对还没有定论的科学问题，固然免不了会有两家、多家 的争鸣。但对已有定论的科学问题，一家独鸣也属正常。在五十年代，对遗传学的 一些基本问题，早已有了定论，若无政府的干预，本来就应该只有摩尔根学派的一 家独鸣。米丘林主义乃是政府人为树立的伪科学学派，本无争鸣的资格。如果我们 将“百家”理解为个人，那么也绝不是人人都有在科学问题上争鸣的资格。想到科 学领域争鸣，首先要遵循科学的标准，使用共同的科学语言。用穆勒的比喻，即是 不能用巫术的语言到医学、用占星术的语言到天文学争鸣。片面地强调百家争鸣， 就有可能为伪科学开方便之门。实际上“百家争鸣”到今天仍然是伪科学者试图插 足科学领域的一大借口。 如果非要为发展科学找一条必由之路的话，那就是：让科学按自己的规则，独 立、自主地发展。 （Marxism and the Philosophy of Science: A Critical History, by Helena Sheehan, Humanities Press International, 1993; 《百家争鸣－－发展科学的 必由之路－－1956年8月青岛遗传学座谈会纪实》，李佩珊等编，商务印书馆， 1985） 2000.4.30. ______________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, write to xys_friends-unsubscribe@listbot.com ______________________________________________________________________ Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com